Ban Dispute (Hodgparjor)

[ObamaTM]

Punishment Type: Ban
Appeal Type: Dispute[Evidence]
Which staff member issued the punishment?: Hodgparjor
How long were you banned/blacklisted for?: 4 Days

Your Steam Name: DDDDDDDDDDDD
Your Roleplay Name: Alwin von-shilton
Your SteamID: STEAM_0:1:130222364

Why were you banned/blacklisted?: 2.5, 3.4 - User shot at police to free his handcuffed friend, however no charges were to be issued against his friend, which the user would know if he investigated prior to shooting police.

Why should this appeal be considered?: First of all, I want to say how I don't have any clue how I was banned for 2.5, In no way I had been excessively negative to anyone there, the whole situation that happened was two of my mates/organisation members had been in a police chase by the police, I was in our apartment at this time not apart of the situation, One of my mates told me how they were being chased and going to get arrested by the police and shots from the police have been exchanged, the whole time I had been unaware of whatever crime they committed but I went out to try find them as I knew it would of been serious if shots were involved, when I got down there I went to run over the police as I had been told it is allowed in order to rescue my mate from prison however I missed and so I jumped out and began shooting, I didn't hit anyone because I am a shitter but I died and got cuffed, my friend was then uncuffed and told that he could leave after I had been killed and tried to rescue him; this whole time he was unsure what he was being arrested for since the guy who originally started the chase had not responded, he was told he was released AFTER I tried to break him out, the moderator taking my report Hodgparjor was present at the scene at the time so he would have known that my org member wasn't told he was able to leave afterwards, When Hodgparjor opened the ticket against me he told me how I should have investigated it however I don't think that is reasonable since in a situation like this where my org members were being shot at I didn't have much time to react in order to free them. Also I am not able to investigate with my friend being in cuffs which I thought to be a bit silly. That is pretty much what happened, In the ticket which Hodgparjor had opened against me he just kept saying how my friend was being released and how I should have investigated it however as I stated before, shots were being fired towards them, he was in cuffs and unable to talk so I instinctively went to defend them, In the PLPD police hand book it states "Serious Offences: When deadly force reasonably and objectively appears to be necessary to protect the general public from a serious offence. Examples: The subject in question is driving reckless to the point where it is posing an imminent threat to the general public or officers. OR The subject is currently armed with a firearm and the officers believe that without any doubt, the subject will use it." so I assumed it would be a serious offence which Hodgparjor should know since he is a Staff Sergeant in the PLPD. I do believe that this could have just been a misunderstanding for Hodgparjor but he never actually gave me enough time to defend myself within the in game ticket, he was rushed and persistent that I was being banned. In the ticket he said how I was only able to free him if he risked a 7 year sentence, I looked throughout the whole rules and no where did it state that; however as I said I was not informed of their sentence as they didn't tell it to them. Thank you, and I'm sorry for any inconveniences I had caused.

 

[A1L]

As this is a dispute, you need to provide some sort of evidence, such as your demo.

3.4 also states as an example to kill police officers: Risk of a long prison sentence

a long prison sentence is 7+ years.

Guide to help you with your demo
Website you can use to upload your demo

Your demo should be perpheads_demo_2023-10-4 18-44-22

 

[ObamaTM]

As this is a dispute, you need to provide some sort of evidence, such as your demo.

3.4 also states as an example to kill police officers: Risk of a long prison sentence

a long prison sentence is 7+ years.

Guide to help you with your demo
Website you can use to upload your demo

Your demo should be perpheads_demo_2023-10-4 18-44-22

3.4 does state "Some valid reasons to kill police officers include: Risk of a long prison sentence" however no where else in the rules does it state how a long prison sentence is 7 years or longer, I'm sure you can understand how that can cause some confusion, and I even stated above how the police had never informed my org members how they were being sentenced or if they were going to be sentenced, all I knew was they were being shot at and when a police officer shoots it is a "Serious Offence" Anyway, here is a demo of the situation;

. In the demo clip you see, you can see me driving over first seeing my mate with his bright pink car, I drove by even hearing him talk, when I first attempt to run him over and miss horribly you can hear an officer talking about shootings, and that is when I jumped out of my vehicle and begin shooting at him, as I assume they are talking about the situation which they are involved in right now. I believe this should have been enough "investigation" or at least all that is possible without me leaving and asking the police if my org member was being arrested as I would want to keep an upper hand on the fight; as anyone would, again here you don't see me breaking rule 2.5 which I believe to be just stupidly put in here as I'm confused to myself why it is here. Again as I stated above I had minimal information going into this situation all I was aware of was my mates were being arrested and being shot at. My other org member had gotten in trouble by Hodgparjor for shooting back at an officer who shot at him which I also believe to be stupid and abuse of power, however he was not punished for it.

 

[A1L]

I don't really think that shows actual proper investigation, surely you could've went up to him and tried to see if he was actually being arrested and or what the actual crime was, instead of trying to help him escape as soon as possible and when you couldn't drive off, sure I understand you think it might cause confusion, however it's known a long prison sentence is 7+ years, although you might not know it, what do you think is considered a long prison sentence if you think what they did was worthy of a long prison sentence? It's lacking a bit of information on why your friend was actually shot at hence why I asked for your demo to see if they mentioned it, did they mention why they were shot at? 2.5 might of been a push to add to your ban however I can see where the 3.4 has come from.

Do you have any more video to show prior to this? As to see if your friend stated why he was being chased/shot at and what exactly happened? There wasn't really much time from your video you've provided for you to ask your friend or anything when you could've went near him and asked him what happened.

 

[ObamaTM]

I don't really think that shows actual proper investigation, surely you could've went up to him and tried to see if he was actually being arrested and or what the actual crime was, instead of trying to help him escape as soon as possible and when you couldn't drive off, sure I understand you think it might cause confusion, however it's known a long prison sentence is 7+ years, although you might not know it, what do you think is considered a long prison sentence if you think what they did was worthy of a long prison sentence? It's lacking a bit of information on why your friend was actually shot at hence why I asked for your demo to see if they mentioned it, did they mention why they were shot at? 2.5 might of been a push to add to your ban however I can see where the 3.4 has come from.

Do you have any more video to show prior to this? As to see if your friend stated why he was being chased/shot at and what exactly happened? There wasn't really much time from your video you've provided for you to ask your friend or anything when you could've went near him and asked him what happened.

After the scenario had ended, I found out from my other mate, who had been shooting at the officer which shot at them originally, that that officer was not actually suppose to be shooting at them, which had caused this whole thing to spiral into a more complicated matter than it should have been. https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachme...cbb01d2b6c570b7c5d189e57f9cb7813b233ec8ae2ce&, The whole reason I had actually came out there was because they told me how they have shot therefore, I just assumed how the situation was important, as in the PLPD handbook it states, "(a) Use of Deadly force: Deadly force means force that is used against another individual that is likely to cause serious bodily harm or death to the individual in question. The Use of Deadly force may be used if one or more of the following circumstances exists." and "Serious Offences: When deadly force reasonably and objectively appears to be necessary to protect the general public from a serious offense. Examples: The subject in question is driving reckless to the point where it is posing an imminent threat to the general public or officers. OR The subject is currently armed with a firearm, and the officers believe that without any doubt, the subject will use it.", As you yourself are a high-ranking officer, you should know these and how firearms being shot are not done unless it is a serious crime. As stated, deadly force was initiated, so we had retaliated with it.

 

[A1L]

I'm speaking to Hodgparjor for more information and context of the situation, I agree that 2.5 can be removed, however still looking into the 3.4, Can you upload your demo?

 

[Blokexd]

I'm speaking to Hodgparjor for more information and context of the situation, I agree that 2.5 can be removed, however still looking into the 3.4, Can you upload your demo?.

I'm one of his mates, he went off to go sleep. I've messaged him on discord and he said he is going to send the demo and stuff tomorrow.

 

[ObamaTM]

I'm speaking to Hodgparjor for more information and context of the situation, I agree that 2.5 can be removed, however still looking into the 3.4, Can you upload your demo?

This is the demo your looking for, my other clip arleady shows everything from my perspective but this one is from my mate which actually shows the shooting going on.

 

[ObamaTM]

and i wont respond until tomorrow because im gonna go sleep now

 

[A1L]

I asked for your raw demo file not you recording the clip like I've asked twice now

 

[ObamaTM]

I asked for your raw demo file not you recording the clip like I've asked twice now

https://demo.tfu.wtf/upload/demos/perpheads_demo_2023-10-4%2018-44-22.dem

 

[A1L]

https://demo.tfu.wtf/upload/demos/perpheads_demo_2023-10-4%2018-44-22.dem

I've watched your demo, you could've waited a little bit longer and realised your friend that you tried to help wasn't even the driver and was released after you were shot down so the 3.4 is valid but the 2.5 will be removed from your ban, you and your friend also need to stop jumping into vehicles without roleplaying it properly whilst in handcuffs, at least by using a /me to open the door for them. Also in your demo, all three of you are blatantly metagaming, you don't speak at all, and you've claimed in your dispute 'One of my mates told me how they were being chased and going to get arrested by the police and shots from the police have been exchanged', how exactly were you even told this? I don't see anyway that you could've been told this except in a third party application, you weren't told via organisation chat, organisation teamspeak, text message, phone call, nothing. You also seem to know more that you should, such as when your friend had bought Office, you suddenly know to goto The Office afterwards. When you weren't even told by anyone, you proceeded to goto the exact location of the cuffed passenger and try to get them in the car with no proper planning, seems like you also probably communicated this on a third party application.

This is the rule for Metagaming:

3.2 Third Party Communication Applications​

Any and all forms of communication about any topic which affects In-Character decisions must be conducted through In-Character methods; for example, through the use of in-game voice chat. The use of communication applications outside of this game is strictly forbidden; for example, the use of Steam chat, TeamSpeak, Discord, Skype, telephones, etc.

 

[ObamaTM]

I've watched your demo, you could've waited a little bit longer and realised your friend that you tried to help wasn't even the driver and was released after you were shot down so the 3.4 is valid but the 2.5 will be removed from your ban, you and your friend also need to stop jumping into vehicles without roleplaying it properly whilst in handcuffs, at least by using a /me to open the door for them. Also in your demo, all three of you are blatantly metagaming, you don't speak at all, and you've claimed in your dispute 'One of my mates told me how they were being chased and going to get arrested by the police and shots from the police have been exchanged', how exactly were you even told this? I don't see anyway that you could've been told this except in a third party application, you weren't told via organisation chat, organisation teamspeak, text message, phone call, nothing. You also seem to know more that you should, such as when your friend had bought Office, you suddenly know to goto The Office afterwards. When you weren't even told by anyone, you proceeded to goto the exact location of the cuffed passenger and try to get them in the car with no proper planning, seems like you also probably communicated this on a third party application.

This is the rule for Metagaming:

3.2 Third Party Communication Applications​

Any and all forms of communication about any topic which affects In-Character decisions must be conducted through In-Character methods; for example, through the use of in-game voice chat. The use of communication applications outside of this game is strictly forbidden; for example, the use of Steam chat, TeamSpeak, Discord, Skype, telephones, etc.

Oh, right I was not actually aware of this rule, I have read the rules but I must have missed that one I guess, I'm sorry for any confusion and the your time which I had wasted, I don't usually play these types of servers as I'm usually on servers with suits and other over powered weapons but that was never a rule in any of them, I've been enjoying my time on the server and I want to continue playing, I'm again sorry and I've learnt from this experience that I cannot sit on discord and will only do stuff like that in game.

 

[A1L]

Whilst I could give you the benefit of the doubt by not being aware, it's just that you probably already know this isn't allowed, you were barely speaking but when you guys went to sell your drugs at the Bank, you all went onto organisation teamspeak, weird huh? Anyways, 2.5 has been removed from your ban, 3.2 will be added onto your ban and the other two users will get a small ban for 3.2 as well as I'm not satisified that you guys didn't somehow know about the rule despite the situation above.

Your ban will be extended from 4 days to 1 week, your friends will also receive a 5 day ban each, this is very lenient for a metagaming ban so please wait out the entire thing.