Action Request On Viktor Belinsky/EVIL

[RafaKill2012]

Your Steam/In-game Name: RafaKill2012 / Rafael Ramires

His/Her Steam/In-game Name: EVIL / Viktor Belinsky

His/Her SteamID: STEAM_0:1:19490979

Why Should This Player Be Punished?: The player broke rule #2.1 when he shot me in the head for no apparent reason, simply pointing his gun at me after ordering a medic to revive his friend and then shooting, which isn't a realistic action, as it was plain unjustified murder.

Evidence:

and the whole demo: http://demo.ovh.eu/pt/6bb478cd67c6c1c9fbfa2eab7bf31c53/.

Youtube video is slightly edited to keep it short, highlighting the moments before the incident.

Tick: The incident itself happened at Tick #8603.

Additional Comments and Explanations: At no point before what's shown in the video did I ever meet Viktor or had done anything leading him to kill me.

The reason why I was there was due to my fellow organization members announcing they were in the Suburbs area, more specifically Suburbs House 2. In the demo, it's possible to see I checked the house to see if it was owned and the blue Beetle parked on the other side of the street, which indeed belonged to Matt Walker, another member of The Saints.

Also, I remained in the vicinity of the shootout because I thought my friends had tried to raid Suburbs House 4 and had failed, so I stuck around to check if it had been them. When the shootout actually happened, I thought Viktor was part of my org, due to his suit being a blue/purple color, which is the dress code of The Saints, but neither his name nor his org was rendered from the distance I was.

 

[The Strange Deranged Mage]

Well, I sorta agree that Viktor killing you was a bit unjustified, but in a situation like that he probably became a bit jumpy and scared. When he first saw you it looked like he panicked and probably mistaken you for being armed or being police.
However...

The reason why I was there was due to my fellow organization members announcing they were in the Suburbs area, more specifically Suburbs House 2. In the demo, it's possible to see I checked the house to see if it was owned.

Also, I remained in the vicinity of the shootout because I thought my friends had tried to raid Suburbs House 4 and had failed, so I stuck around to check if it had been them. When the shootout actually happened, I thought Viktor was part of my org, due to his suit being a blue/purple color, which is the dress code of The Saints, but neither his name nor his org was rendered from the distance I was.

Viktor was probably defending someone or people in Subs 4, and was responding to a call of action. Like how he wanted his friend revived, he probably contacted Viktor about needing assistance before he was shot and possibly gave a description of the raiders. If this is true then your death was justified.

 

[EVIL]

• We had scouted the area prior, taking note of those who were affiliated with the base. We left do to PLPD activity, however not before I saw you purple fucks running up to them. Just as I had witnessed your meeting with the organisation who were in the base.
• You arrive to see me fucking everyone up with an AK-47. You are unarmed, so you decide to enter a huge ass shootout between criminals and the PLPD... Unarmed (Clearly risking your own life 3.3, and 3.4).
• Also note you were unarmed, entering a shootout
• You didn't take into consideration that I possibly could have brutally murdered all of your friends in that house. (Which I did)
• Even when shots are literally fired in your direction, you crouch behind a police car, making no effort to get away from the shootout (1:21) - In fact, you even peep on the boot of the police car, to see whats going on (3.3, 3.4)
• The officer states "Is there any more officers?" clearly indicating the PLPD are losing, and therefore who ever is in the house, is pushing out... Towards you... You do not act
• 1:47 you see me running out of the house in which I murdered all your friends.... You do nothing, just sit and watch, waiting for the inevitable.
• 2:29 you see me get out of my car.... And crouch, attempting to hide. I'm not sure how you greet your 'friends' but that seems a little off. Almost as if you didn't expect me to be as friend of your org at all.. Wasn't really a warm greeting was it.
• 2:41 I get the medic to revive my fallen friend (The medic is an asset of mine, I have a reason to let him live.. For now) I would have killed the medic, had my friend not been downed, as he was a witness to the crime, just like you where.
• 2:42 you get one-banged.

You sat in an active shootout, unarmed, for over 2 mins. Risking your life constantly. What were you expecting?

Another point is: I had just murdered the entire PLPD, everyone in that house, and some randomers who tried helping. Overall that's a lot of fucking bodies. If I was caught, I think its pretty safe to say I was going down for life. Killing, or not killing you wasn't going to change that. If anything keeping you alive was not only pointless to me, it could have had a negative impact, as you could inform the PLPD of my car, weapon, and appearance (Basically you were a witness to my many many crimes). Therefore killing off the last witness, ensured my own safety.

But lets just be honest, if you sat in an active shootout for 2 mins, unarmed. And watch as some guy fucks up everyone in the area, what did you really expect. A hug?.

You've broken the following rules: 3.3, 3.4, 2.1, and 3.6 (Big one).

 

[RafaKill2012]

Alright, here we go, my reply:

- First, don't disrespect me or my friends by calling us "purple fucks", that breaks forum rule #1.1.
- I was armed and willing to use my pistol if I found out that the cops were shooting my friends and that I could survive that encounter.
- Like I said, I was armed, it was an OTs-33 Pernach, pay attention to my inventory wheel in the video (1:51).
- I didn't have proof they had raided and I didn't know it had been you who killed them, if I knew, I would've shot you when you were talking to the medic.
- I crouched so I could take cover, had I remained standing, I would've died much earlier. Running away could have the same result. Of course I stood up for a couple of seconds, I wanted to see if the coast was clear so I could move.
- Knowing there weren't many officers left could've been a good thing if my friends were still alive, I was prepared to kill the remaining cops.
- Again, didn't know you had killed them, as far as I know, you could be helping us or at least clearing the cops around your home.
- When I saw you were driving a black car, I realized you weren't part of the org, so I tried to take cover, thinking you were going to shoot the medic.
- Since you didn't, I thought to myself "Ok, I can leave now, I'll just tell the guy I didn't see anything".
- I tried to do what I mentioned above and you just shot me. No words spoken by either of us.

Alright, onto the rules you say I broke:

3.3 I don't see when I broke that.
3.4 Staying around the shooting was justified, as I was willing to join in to help my friends if needed.
2.1 All my actions were realistic, I took cover when I had to and moved when everything calmed down. I remained as far as I could from the shooters themselves.
3.6 Like I said, I took cover when possible. I had the option to run away, sure, but I wanted to aid my fellow Saints.

 

[EVIL]

Ding ding, round 2:

• In all honest, I feel quite disrespected that this is even a ban request. Kinda puts down all those good shots i made on your friends you know.
• Congratulations, you were armed, that's one thing ticked off. However did the sheer amount of dead bodies on the floor not point something out. Also, congratulations were armed, and unknown to me. Making you a threat. I could have got one-banged in the back of the head when I turned around. Shooting you insured I could focus on the medic, not worry about your ass.
• I mean you can't really say you were armed using an OTS, might as well have used your flaccid penis to beat down the cops. But still, a guns a gun.
• Don't know how clear you want the proof. Personally a shot up house, shit ton of dead bodies, and police cars were just a few of the clues I used to eventually sum up they'd be raided.
• As you stated "You would have shot me", taking down you ensured my safety.
• You didn't know if your friends had raided, so you stayed for 2 mins in a shootout to find out, well done.
• "Wanted to see if the coast was clear so I could move", move a whole 2 meteres to the right. Much safer.
• You could have been killed running, but then as I pointed out, you could have been killed when you ran into the line of fire.... Or when you stayed at a shootout for 2 mins (You did die)
• "Prepared to kill the remaining cops" like the SWAT and medic you did fuck all about.
• So instead of assuming that the AK wielding man who was firing in every direction was a threat, you preserved him to be 100% friendly. More ignorance on your side than mine. If I was in your position, and had seen a man shooting everyone in the area, I wouldn't consider said man to be a trustworthy ally.
• As you stated yourself "You realised I wasn't part of your org" however you still don't move, try and get away, or even react at all really. Other than hiding behind a bush (10/10 for cover though)
• You say you thought I was going to shoot the medic. Did that not cause a spark in your brain that caused you to think: If I was prepared to kill the medic, instead of getting your friends up, perhaps I wasn't really that friendly to you or your allies.
• Since I didn't instantly one-bang the medic you thought "Nice one, I know this guys just murdered a shit ton of people, but he let a medic go, so I must be fine to just walk away".
• "I'll just tell this guy I didn't see anything" RIP. Again ignorance on your part. As if informing me you didn't see anything, was going to make me believe an associate to all those people I killed would keep his mouth shut.
• Look at it from my POV: I've just fucked all of your friends up, they're all laying on the floor with caved-in lead-filled heads, and I know you're one of them. When I leave, you're gonna see them and think "Shit, he just did us right in, I'll tell the police now". I wasn't prepared to let that happen.
• In all honesty, after murdering half the server, I wasn't in the prime position to sit down, have some coffee and a nice chit chat. I wanted to get out of the area (Without witnesses) before anyone else turned up. Unfortunately a Speed Enforcement saw, and I had to run him over too.

3.3: Yea I'll give you that one, my mistake.

3.4: You keep mentioning how you were prepared, but armed with the worlds worst pistol (OTS) you can't say you were really 'prepared' to engage in a multiple person shootout. In fact there was at least 3 occasions in which you could have assisted your friends, instead you stand and watch as the police shoot them. You put your life at risk the moment you stepped into the shootout, especially when you walked into the line of fire. You could have stayed across the street, out of view, if your plan was to jump in and try to spray down a cop or two. Your life was at risk from the start, and your incompetence only got you deeper down the rabbit hole. Especially considering you got one-tapped.

2.1: Took cover beifly, before peeping over the boot to see what was going on. Then walking a full 3" to the hedge. "I remained as far away from the shooters as I could".... Across the street?, don't think so. You could have been behind the police barricades, at subs 2, or subs storage. But no, you choose to stand in the line of fire... Right next to the medic, and then the SWAT. To put it simply you stood next to targets, ultimately making yourself one.

3.6: You're right, you could have run away, saving your own life. But instead you'd rather stay nailed down in gunfire to help your dead friends. Nice sentiment, but not really doing your upmost best to ensure your survival are you. Again, not sure how much aid watching your friends get shot can really give. You have many a chance to get out of the situation, and save yourself, but instead you chose to stand in a shootout, and die.

Its pretty tragic to be honest, that you expected to gain from the situation. But you put yourself in a position where your life no longer meant anything to me. Killing you really made no difference, in fact it only ensured my own safety.

You were killed by me, but the reasons were because of your own incompetence. If you'd have not broken the rules yourself, and placed yourself in a shitty high risk situation, you wouldn't have been confronted with an AK wielding murder.

 

[RafaKill2012]

*Sigh* I didn't want this to become a long-ass argument, but here we go:

- Okay, this is not a ban request. This is an action request, which means the outcome can be one of 3 possibilities. 1, nothing happens, as you're found to not be a rule breaker. 2 You receive a warning due to your rule breaking actions. 3 You get banned for a small amount of time, but I don't think that will happen, a broken 2.1, at least in this case, isn't enough reason for a ban, in my opinion that is. However, I didn't post this request for sport, I want to see something being done about your behavior in this situation.

- So you decided to shoot an apparently unarmed person because in your mind he could interfere with your buddy-reviving endeavour, even though the guy was standing there in a non-agressive way, trying not to get shot. Nice.

- Yes, a gun is a gun. It still has potential to kill someone.

- I don't think you understood what I meant. I didn't have proof that my friends had raided Subs 4. I didn't see any of their bodies around, just the cops'.

- Well, by that logic you might as well kill everyone in the server, that'll definitely ensure your safety. I would have shot you. If, I knew you were my friends' killer.

- Well, I rather stick around to find out and maybe help out than run away and then receive the news my friends are dead.

- Uhm... That was more than 2 meters, and it was farther away from the house, which was the centerpoint of the gunfight.

- I didn't move into the line of fire, however, the officer moved and so, the shots were in my direction when I got to the car. Gotta admit it wasn't a smart decision, I was lucky I wasn't shot.

- There was no reason for me to kill the medic, and I would never pull my gun right in front of a SWAT officer.

- Of course I assumed you were friendly, on a quick glance you actually looked like one of us. Just because someone has an AK it doesn't mean they aren't friendly, specially if said person dresses similarly to a friend. The Saints are a criminal organization, we basically kill for a living, so, someone that looks like us and is using a gun can be assumed to be friendly.

- So, let's say that instead of standing still I had ran away. The only difference in the outcome would be that I would've died in a different section of the sidewalk.

- By the time I thought you were going to shoot the medic, I had already realized you were not a part of my org and I would rather try to reason with you so I'm not killed than try my luck with an OTs vs an AK-47.

- Basically that, yeah. The medic didn't get killed at first because he didn't do anything wrong towards you, so I thought that since I hadn't either, you would let me go. Go ahead, call me naive.

- Well, I didn't know you killed my associates, so from my POV, I was innocent, from yours, I wasn't.

- Yeah, I know you couldn't leave witnesses to what you did, but I was better off giving reasoning a shot.

3.4 I didn't know if my friends were getting shot or not, neither did I know that it was really them raiding. I had to make a close inspection, which didn't actually happen, because, as you said, I got "one-tapped". By a guy I had never met. To me, I'm only guilty of actions I was directly part of, getting shot by reasons I didn't even know wasn't on my mind.

2.1 I actually took cover for quite a while, the video is sped up in that part so it wouldn't take too long. I also didn't think of the medic as a target and the SWAT had just arrived and came to to talk to us, moments before he was pulled out by staff, leaving just the medic and I.

3.6 Yes, I stood in the shootout thinking I could help my friends, which I didn't know were dead. If I did, I wouldn't have stayed.

"Killing you really made no difference"

You see, that's the problem. Killing me made no difference. That is where the problem lies. You killed me even though letting me stay alive would have resulted in the same outcome at the time. Only later would I find out you had killed my friends, or maybe I would've thought the police killed them, so, in the end, I died for nothing, which translates to RDM.



However, it's true, if your friend was raided by our gang, then you have all the right to have revenge on us. But you could at least have told me, directly or indirectly, by the means of a question like "Are you a friend of those guys in purple?" or something like that, why I was gonna be killed. In short, you killed me because I was part of the org that raided your friend's house, but I didn't know they had raided him/her, making me clueless as to why I was shot and killed, all I ask is that you admit you could have at least said something before killing me, which in result wouldn't get down to this action request.

 

[MrAaron]

Hi Rafael what I can see here is that you entered a crime scene / raid where it hasn't gone well for the police and you want to get the guns off of the bodies.

• Viktor took out all of the cops and didn't leave any witnesses not even the medics.
• He had a fast escape plan and you saw his car.
• All of your mates came back to the house after dying hence why one S.W.A.T. got taken away.
• He had to take out a few guys who turned against him and you was a threat.

People have adrenaline rushes and he may have been in one so I'm not with you on this one I don't understand why you would walk into a crime scene? hoping to find a gun and possibly kill Viktor.

 

[EVIL]

Let me first start off by saying, at first this was funny, now you're just getting annoying. Please take time to read what I said, and the answers you're looking for should be found.

I gathered you wanted a quick and easy revenge ban. Looks like we'll have to do it the long way round.

• Thank you for educating me on the Perpheads justice system. However, I'm pretty sure I've got it all worked out.
• Yes, that's exactly why I shot you. Had you not been there (AKA: Risking your life), I wouldn't have been able to shoot you. But considering you stood in a shootout, yes, you were shoot. (See 'Shootout')
• It does indeed, but you might as well wish the enemy gets struck by lightening rather than use an OTS. As you said yourself, you didn't fancy the odds between and AK-47 and an OTS. So therefore you didn't fancy the odds between your OTS, and the PLPD. Meaning that you entered a crime scene, with a weapon you knew wouldn't be effective enough to ensure your safety - So you risked your life.
• That's even worse... You had no proof to even suggest your friends raided subs 4. It was a lucky guess. So for all you knew, you could have been stood in an active shootout, watching some randomers shoot at the PD. So you didn't even risk your life for your friends... You put your life in incredible danger, because you THOUGHT your friends were in a house.
• I don't think this is getting through to you. I had no reason to kill everyone in the server, because they hadn't stood and watched as I maimed two full groups of people. Had you not seen me do it, or at least run away, you'd have survived yourself.
• You've said yourself if you found out I killed your friends, you'd kill me. (And tell your friends upon their return) in all honesty I didn't fancy having a full org after me. Making you a threat.
• You'd rather get killed, than get news you're friends are dead... Perfect plan.
• You're right, it was probably less than two meters from the police car to the hedge. Either way, the police car and driveway you stood in was in my direct line of fire. You're lucky you didn't get a stray bullet to the face.
• Lets take a look at the video: 1:17 you see me with my AK on the driveway of the house. However you disregard that and continue running towards the car. So you're almost directly in-front of my gunfire. Seen at 1:20.
• There was no reason to kill the medic, apart from the medic trying to revive downed officers, who would go on to fight your friends, IF they were there (Which you couldn't prove). So you're saying you weren't prepared to shoot the SWAT. In a shootout between the PLPD and criminals, did you not expect a SWAT team to arrive?. You had to, and you knew you weren't well equipped enough to take the SWAT on. Therefore you were aware you were risking your life.
• Of course I looked friendly, after I had filled everyone inside and outside of that house up with bullets. Again your own incompetence got you killed. So because I wear the same colour as your people, you assumed I was friendly. Again your own naivety let you down.
• "We kill for a living", so you're a criminal, in a criminal position, and you're armed, and you kill for a living. There's a good few reasons why I shot you. There's no honour among thieves. How do you expect me to believe you're not gonna try and shoot me when I turn my back to you, I mean you do "kill for a living" + I had an AK, who doesn't want a free AK.
• By 'run away' I mean 'run away', not jog down the pavement and stop a few houses down. I mean, run away to subs 2, to storage, anywhere but the fat shootout that you put yourself right in the middle off.
• You realised I wasn't part of your org (Don't know why you didn't ask in org chat for the 2 mins you were sat there pondering as to who the killer might be). You've heard my gunshots, so you know I'm using an AK, or at least a rifle. However you enter anyway (Not knowing who I am). As you say yourself, you didn't fancy your chances with a OTS vs and AK. Displaying how you risked your life entering the crime scene knowing you were outgunned.
• You're naive
• You're incredibly naive. And also, think about it logically, I just murdered a shit ton of people. I want to leave, and disappear before any more witnesses (Such as yourself) arrive, or another wave of law enforcement. Not sit down and have a nice conversation with you (Knowing I killed your pals). I didn't want to, and even if I did, I didn't have time... As I left Speed Enforcement arrived, indicating another wave on PLPD was approaching. It was safer for me to take you out, and leave swiftly.
• Congratulations, you're right. Personally I would have been weary of the guy with the AK who shot everyone, but never mind that. From my POV you were:

1. A member of an org who I just killed every member of (apart from you, at the time)
2. A witness to my many crimes
3. A possible threat
4. Another thing to focus on while I was dealing with the medic
5. Someone who I had seen around the house, and talking to the houses occupants. Therefore, I knew you were associated with it (As I've said in my first reply).

• Reasoning?. I didn't have time to reason, nor did I trust you. I had no reason to trust you, and as I've said a countless number of times, you put yourself in that situation. I wouldn't have been able to kill you, had you not been there. But instead of preserve your life, you'd rather sit and get shot at, at a house you don't even know if your friends are in.

I've informed you why you broke the rules. I'm not going over it again.

You didn't even know your friends where the house, you stood, in a fat shootout between the PLPD and criminals. Because your friends MAY have been there (Again not sure why you didn't ask).

It translates as you being a spastic. What I said is, you put yourself in a position in which your life no longer meant anything to me. You weren't innocent, as you were a member of a criminal organisation, and had watched me kill a fuck ton of people. If anything keeping you alive was the most risky option I had. Killing you ensured I was safe at the time, and would continue to be safer after the raid.

Really simply now, just for you:

If you hadn't have broken the rules, and risked your life over you friends potentially being at a property that was under siege. You wouldn't have been killed, because you wouldn't have been in the situation. However, your shitty decision to enter the active crime scene, when you knew yourself you were under equipped and not in a position to A) take out multiple targets, and B) take on SWAT or heavily armed people, is what got you killed. You were a witness to my many crimes, and the last lose end that could inform your people or the PLPD, of what I did. You were also a threat to me (as two people inside the house had turned on me, when they first appeared friendly). I didn't know if you were armed, and I could have been killed as soon as I turned my back to you. I needed to focus on the medic, and to get the fuck out of there, you were the last thing stopping me from doing those things. Therefore I made the immediate choice to put you down, instead of risking further injury to myself.

 

[danny]

As stated above by various people, Evil had a perfectly valid reason to kill you, and therefore will not be receiving a punishment. You, however, will be receiving a warning for breaking 2.1, 3.4 and 3.6 because you entered the shootout for no valid reason.​