Ban Dispute (ellie)

[Kyousuke]

Punishment Type: Ban
Appeal Type: Dispute[Evidence]
Which staff member issued the punishment?: ellie
How long were you banned/blacklisted for?: 5 Days

Your Steam Name: Kyousuke
Your Roleplay Name: Jerry Johntagus
Your SteamID: STEAM_0:0:84541580

Why were you banned/blacklisted?: 1.4, 1.6, 3.4 - User deliberately tried to mislead staff in report regarding him risking his life in a shootout to pick up a weapon. Then started to argue and slander about staff abusing their power to get their friends their guns back. Longer ban due to receiving a warning for 3.4 only two days earlier.

Why should this appeal be considered?: In the clip, I was walking by the slums apartments. There was a gun on the ground, I walked towards it and before I picked it up I looked into the building where I saw nobody. So I picked up the gun, looked into the building again and I saw nobody. I don't understand how this is a risk to my life, I do understand there were gunshots from inside the building after I picked it up, but there was no-one that could have harmed me in sight, so I felt that I was allowed to pick up the gun seeing as it was just sitting there. Then comes the report with ellie, not a very nice interaction if i'd say. This report went on for about 45 minutes or so, I didn't give up easily because I wanted to dig deeper as I was sure that when I picked up the gun my life was not threatened once. She then said I was wasting her time and "misleading her" when all I did was ask "how do you know if I wasn't part of the shootout", that was a question, not a statement. Then I replied "I wasn't wasting your time, your job is to dig deeper in situations like this" then she replies "This isn't my job, I don't get paid for it lol" which doesn't seem very professional to me. Not being bothered to take time into a report against me (where I was unsure what I had done wrong) and banning me instead shouldn't be your first go-to. Not once did I "deliberately try to mislead staff", all I did was ask a question regarding my position in the shootout.

Additional Information: Thanks for reading my appeal

 

[Ellie]

Here you continuously talking like I didn't know you were a part of the situation or not and you refused to answer if you wanted to give back the weapon or not after asking you 4 times to do so. I had a discussion about rule 3.4 two days go when you received a warning for that rule, which I expected you to actually read after out report. Logs clearly shows you went to bank, then you were gonna get your mini from the impound but then stopped by the active shoot out to minge grab a weapon.

10 minutes in the report you said you had a clip which shows that there was an active shoot out only 1 floor above you and shots were actually being fired and a cop died at the same time as you picked up the gun;

It was pure luck that the cops already was inside, because 25 seconds later the raid was over and they were collecting the guns and realised one gun was missing.

And I don't appreciate your attitude and slander, claiming I abuse my rank to get the gun back despite you not breaking any rules what so ever. Then I made a report with you and you sent the video several other Moderators saw the video and they agreed with me, so I don't see how this isn't you breaking the rules.

I explained the rule 3.4 and you also can read about it by pressing F1 or on the top on the forums, but you made it sound like I didn't investigate the whole situation, which I clearly did. And I still stand by my word; This isn't my job, I'm not getting paid. This is a volunteer position to help the community and the server so everyone have a positive RP experience. If you don't have one, that's unfortunate, but the people who reported you for breaking the rules didn't have a positive experience because of you either, it works both ways.

If someone steals your gun and breaking the rules by doing so, then refuse to give the weapon back,
don't you want the person to receive a punishment so you're eligible for a refund?​

 

[Kyousuke]

You're saying you don't appreciate my attitude whilst throughout that report you had snarky remarks like "lmao" and "lol" in your messages. Literally not once did I say I wasn't going to give the gun back. I wanted to know what I had done wrong that is why the report went on for so long. I didn't respond to your question because again, I wanted to know why you had a report against me. How could I have known that 25 seconds later the raid was over, by then I was gone. During the ticket you did not include these crucial details. I've been playing the server for a week or two now and you expect me to know all the rules perfectly, I understand that you told me to not ram cars two days ago, I didn't check the 3.4 meaning because I thought that was the meaning (ramming cars) not "risking your life". And I did not purposely break the rules or waste your time. All I was doing was defending myself because I did not know a grab-and-go was not allowed. I also did not know the raid was about to be over.

 

[Ellie]

How could I have known that 25 seconds later the raid was over, by then I was gone.

I also did not know the raid was about to be over.

Exactly, you don't know, that's why you don't risk your life for a silly little gun.

 

[Kyousuke]

What about the part where I didn't say I wasn't going to give the gun back, I was defending myself. I get that I didn't respond to you asking but you kind of jumped to conclusions there.

 

[Ellie]

I asked you 4 times and you refused to respond to my question so I took that as you were unwilling to give it back.

 

[Kyousuke]

I mean I was just trying to figure out what I had done, as I said I was defending myself because I was unsure. And I apologise if you believed I was wasting your time, but I was just protecting myself.

 

[Bnjemann]

I’ll review this with whoever I can find right now

 

[Kyousuke]

Cheers

 

[Bnjemann]

Seems like you need a more detailed account on what exactly you had done wrong.

At the start of the video, you seek towards an active shootout both unarmed and on foot. You see someone unconscious and approach them. At no point do you consider the risk of someone shooting you straight up on sight. Given the nature of police shootouts at slums, if a criminal were covering the door as you approached they would be able to shoot you without staff punishment by claiming they thought you were an officer, hostile, or that you were approaching said weapon.

You “checking it was clear before taking” Was a mere 2 second quick peek, which makes as little difference to the situation as tip toe-ing through a minefield would. You then, with your back to the door, pick up the weapon. You never accounted for a shooter peeking from either under the stairs or atop them as you took the weapon, or the vulnerable state you put yourself in by stealing it as you stared at the floor in the opposite direction to someone who could shoot you.

You aren’t valuing your life over possessions and you’re risking, at the very least, prison, but most likely being shot down and Killed solely to steal a weapon that has been used in a crime.

Your plan then was to run through the city, with said stolen weapon that had been used in a violent crime, on full display on your back as you jog on foot to wherever you’re going. You clearly had no other plan to transport said weapon than this. You also ran past a police NPC in the booth, I assume you made no attempt at dealing with them?

The benefit of stealing a strangers weapon worth about a 30 minute job wage from a shootout you aren’t involved with before it’s original operator has even bled out is outweighed by the risk you put yourself under and to be honest with you we fully agree with Ellie’s decision on the 3.4 ban.

As for the 1.6, You insinuating that you’re possibly part of the shootout was time wasting and dishonest as someone who was less aware of the situation dealing with a report on you would otherwise have to verify this, thus wasting more time. Your refusal to give the gun back also constitutes as 1.6. If staff tell you to do something in game of that nature you have to do it. If you have a problem, you make a staff complaint. If you were in the right, you’ll get the gun back and might not have to deal with that person as staff again.

In terms of the “snarky and rude”, I think it’s fair in this situation that @Ellie would otherwise express waning patience with your overall stalling of the report. If you disagree with their choice of language when dealing with you, you should make a staff complaint, but I advise against it because it’d be a waste of time.

Reviewed with @Sean