“Raiding isn’t realistic roleplay” Why you’re technically wrong.

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I’ve seen this all to much, people claiming that “raiding” isn’t roleplay, and that its responsible for killing the game mode. Ive disagreed with this fair bit.

Allow me to explain the mechanics of it and how it correlates to actual roleplay:

1: The drug dealer and growing:

The way perp works with drugs, from a roleplay perspective, people growing are doing so mostly to sell to the drug dealer. By doing this, they are assuming the role of a drugs supplier, meeting up with a contact at secluded locations to sell their drugs.

Unfortunately with the way it works currently, the drug dealer accepts infinite amounts of any drug for a fixed price regardless on how common the drug is and how abundant it is.

Realistically however, the drug dealer wouldn’t accept millions of the same drug from different people and would most likely focus on who can supply the most for the best price, which brings us onto our next point.

2: Supply and demand:

Allow me to explain basic economics of the underworld markets here:

Just like with any markets, supply and demand is key in drugs production and sales. The harder a drug is to produce or import, Paired with the more people who want it, the more money it’d cost. Cocaine is in huge abundance in Paralake due to everyone growing it, therefor realistically, this would cause issues for people trying to profit from it due to the market becoming so hyper inflated of these drugs that they’re worth next to nothing, making dealing drugs a small penny profit as people are able to produce Cocaine with minimal risk of police or rival intervention.

Which will bring us to:

3: cornering the market through deduction and elimination of competition:

Ever wonder why drug dealers irl have dogs, cameras, and weapons? Because the stuff they are carrying and producing is worth more per gram than gold in some cases. It sells quickly and at a pretty penny and anyone who gets their hands on it could quickly resell it simply by hanging around a pub or club. But how can they guarantee profit if they’re buying it to resell? Simple answer here is to steal it. 0 money spent would mean you would make a profit regardless of how much you resell for.

Furthermore, eliminating competition of other drugs manufacturers and dealers makes your product harder to find, meaning that people who want it would be more likely to come to you as opposed to anyone else. If the demand exceeds the supply from multiple sources then this means that a single organisation has the money and resources to expand into a drugs empire. In an ideal drug dealer career on PERP, you’ll want to be the guy everyone comes to if they want to buy or sell drugs, just like IRL.

Furhermore:

4: It happens IRL:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mexican_drug_war

5: the police aspect:

Raids are (albeit often wasted by officers) a perfect opportunity for the police force and its supporting government services to coordinate themselves like a real police force, manning cordons and positioning themselves tactically like a real police force. It gives them opportunities to utilise equipment, communication and coordination in order to restore the peace. It’s good fun when everyone actually works together, albeit nowadays, cops just run in despite superiors orders Willy nilly then blame the gameplay mechanics when they immediately die.


6: final notes:
Quite often its a very esporty experience raiding with the call outs in discord org TS however its a video game and therefor such actions are expected from a video game.

Furthermore, a huge reason why perp is enjoyed by so many is because the combat mechanics of PERP exceed those of other servers and games, as well as having a “less serious” seriousRP approach to otherwise absent combat mechanics found on other seriousRP servers, such as /me’ing taking guns on safety and reloading and no “injuryRP” Where if you get shot to Low HP you have to sit crouched until a medic heals you with 400 /me’s and /desc’s.


I’ll update this when I’m not on mobile to patch out any errors or to add more points but this is just my 2 cents on the matter.​
 
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let people do what they want, paralake is just a dump irl like the south of england
 
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raids and shootouts are apart of perp. If you don't like it then leave?
 
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the problem isn't that they're a part of perp, the problem is that it can get to be up to 70% of the entirety of what's happening on the server that day, and it sometimes feels like I'm in Donbass.

Peope don't want to do something fun or creative, they just want click head get dopamine, make montage, get rating and then dopamine again get ego and hate on those who say clicking montage not fun
 
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is there really anything else to do though? sure, you can make passive RP shit but it gets boring fast when the majority of the server is sitting in a base growing drugs because it averages 20 people a day; it's something that's never going to change
 
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"Raids are (albeit often wasted by officers) a perfect opportunity for the police force and its supporting government services to coordinate themselves like a real police force, manning cordons and positioning themselves tactically like a real police force."

Well in real life, if you decide to rob a house and barricade yourself, you got a whole army outside waiting to take you down. However on perp, It's like cops aren't even a threat. I have been in countless of times where a bunch of people armed with AKS just rush in a building and then come out and destroy every cop they see. If this were to happen in real life, most likely the police will win since the advantage they have in: Numbers, equipment, information etc.
In perp it's usually very likely that the crims will win. Cops and their little M9 pistols won't do anything against an org wielding rifles and driving around in supercars running over every cop. Let's be honest here, cops won't stand a chance against a whole org...
Imo, the crims have a bigger advantage than cops unlike real life.
Pretty sure if you were to eliminate a whole police department in real life, you would be looking at an army...
Crims do whatever they want with cops here ( The only time where cops might win, is when you have a full police department and most of them are TFU in heavy gear. which EVEN THAT sometimes lose against the crims.)
 
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police mostly loses cause they have no idea how to play to be useful in the gamemode when dealing with shootouts, while crims are usually experienced players that coordinate well since they play together a lot.

One of the basic, most simple things was when i just came back to PD and i was an officer, i was literally the only person setting perimeters, making clear over text radio that I am on the said perimeter and every minute reporting if anyone is vulturing or if I see someone, and requesting backup if needed, or if I can tell we're about to get flanked. (all over text radio, not to clutter voice).

If someone drives past or near perimeter with phone in hand, and they speed off towards storage you should alarm officers, use common sense. Double barricades everywhere except middle which had spikes.
Crims have more to lose so they try harder most of the time.

Did I die many many times? Yes.
But my death was always useful regardless if I got the flanker or not since:
1. The flanker has to go through me to shoot cops, that means he needs to risk dying to me before he even gets a chance to aim at the main force.
2. My life alert procs, and with the information I gave you that I am on the perimeter, you now know you're getting flanked so you can divert your attention and change the game plan.



and many other things to win in shootouts can be used to win against criminals.
 
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You can't really say that we die because we don't communicate... In almost every raid there are supercars driving over half of the police force, hopping out with an AK and just killing everyone. There is really nothing that cops we can do because we can't shoot at the car since it's driving fast and we have no idea if you have a weapon or not, meanwhile the driver can just kill at any time...
The problem is, it's always in the crims favour on perpheads however not in real life, we all know that if you barricade yourself and go outside to kill the cops, you will get fucked real good. Because most of the times criminals don't have military grade weapons, hand grenades fast supercars and a whole org ready to wipe a PD...
 
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ok but u dont have an entire city growing cocaine 24/7 either
 
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Cops only lose because they push inside, raiders absolutely have an advantage with this. As @money said, police have every advantage from the start but give up their hand too early.
Additionally, people often drive straight through road barricades and threaten IA when stopped and arrested for inevitably carrying a firearm. I don’t blame cops for ignoring perimeters as they are literally the most awful thing to sit at and managers with every funny man in the city trying to run you over and shoot you.

back in the day when police organized for a raid in the PD parking lot and strategized before arriving proved a lot more powerful and interesting. All that has to happen is current PD supervisors have to organize the forces and create some interesting strategy and RP rather than gearing up as TFU and throwing a flash that blinds everyone on the stairs.

@BigBenji i encourage you to train TFU to not rush in and be more strategic. I’ve seen @money camped outside projex for over an hour and hold raiders inside by himself. With the addition of a full police force and TFU trained like him, this is absolutely winnable in almost every situation. Perimeters, holding positions and being strict win every raid
 
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"Additionally, people often drive straight through road barricades and threaten IA when stopped and arrested for inevitably carrying a firearm. I don’t blame cops for ignoring perimeters as they are literally the most awful thing to sit at and managers with every funny man in the city trying to run you over and shoot you."

Holy fuck finally someone understands, that is the most metagaming shit ever, they pull up to a barricade and try to kinda squeeze in and you stop them or cuff them and then they threaten some new officer to let them go or they will make an IA and obviously the officer is worried so they let them go and get shot in 5 seconds, people who do that shit are actual cunts, IA shouldn't be used as a threat to gain an advantage over an officer that is detaining you because you're SUS af. Had people even use OOC to threatened IA and report and then they came back and shot us, if I'd know back then I'd do something
 
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@blackdown TFU are already trained and encouraged to push as groups, this is better than ”training“ them to not push at all. Not pushing and holding a door whilst executing a search warrant should be last resort for TFU.
 
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i think you like curak also pushed it to extremes and took it at face value. TFU should be the one to push and take down the main force. Even in the example he's given there I've went in that hour through 5 waves of 3-4 TFU officers and 1-2 shotgun officers per wave push, who pushed together while I held the position with a sniper and fended off the flankers with 2-3 other officers, but sadly the main force that pushed lost while pushing. Raiders ultimately all died when they killed the last wave and tried to push the doorway.
Point is, at least to cover the answer about how PD loses mostly, ultimately not only aimed at those in gear but all supervisors commanding the scene, that resource management should be priority. You can't train people to have common sense, but if you want to win in shootouts you're gonna need to coordinate units and work with what you have. Resource management is also another reason PD loses, retreating and/or fortifying the position is sometimes a great move.

what he means by strategic I assume includes better resource management rather than full on committing to an assault if you start to lose heavily or get stopped in your tracks, which tends to happen quite often if you're pushing a narrow doorway. Ideal conditions of: c2 -> 3-4 second cook that blinds majority does not happen very often, and sometimes the 3-4 defenders simply end up halting the initial push completely, at which point you should either pull resources from outside or halt the assault while they respawn.
 
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Lets be honest here: Perp in this state is nothing more then a cops and robbers server.

Getting blackscreend 5 times within a hour is more common then someone setting up a proper shop.
 
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I used to set up a coffee shop, and I planned on advertising it but kept leaving because it would be afking, or playing piano in the shop for hours on end and either have days where no one would come or I'd have people sometimes come in and be nice even some police officers, that left very generous tips but also had people run in, say something stupid then run out, or once I got followed into my shop like by someone touching my back, gunpointed and asked to lock the doors and then they mugged me, worst part is one of them is on the staff team like bruh discourages roleplay, if anyone can mug u if theres a bush in the way while you're trying to passive rp it really turns me off the server
 
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I understand you completely, but that is RP. you cannot force anyone to RP in a certain way, and even the staff team can sometimes be described as a douchie way to ''roleplay''. After all, being an admin does not mean someone knows how to roleplay.

In the end, it is about hoping a person enjoys roleplay and likes to do it with you, rather than holding a gun, shooting or mugging you. Because these people that encourage roleplay are the ones you'd want to keep and befriend with. Those are the ones making this server interesting enough to spend your time on.
 
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Unfortunately roleplay isn’t invalid if it doesnt go your way and there’s preventative measures you can take In character to prevent / minimise the risk of you getting robbed.
 

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I agree that the whole fighting and killing for drugs is realistic but it is still a bit of a stretch to call it roleplay.

It is difficult to get the balance right but as others have said, in real life if I went to rob another drug dealer and then ended up shooting them and 5 cops then there is 1% chance I’m getting out of that in anything other than cuffs or a body bag
 
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i mean perp is hella boring. Shootouts its the most fun and me as the Mega Roach, approaching a shootout unarmed or with a shit cheap weapon then just clean the floor up is big profit or just use the next gun on the ground and start shooting everything that breathes. Ez profit and ez shootout entered.
 
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I hope you’re aware that you are not allowed to get involved with a shootout you’re not involved with in anyway... also please don’t grab guns mid shootout as it’s risking your life :)
 
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well if i know the person getting raided i just grab a gun myself then join the shootout then mid shootout if its safe to grab i then grab basicly upgrading the weapon to shoot with. I've done this so often that i became professional
 
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It is dependent on what is meant with Roleplay. Perceiving raiding as roleplay is one thing, but actually implementing role-playing elements to it is also another way of Roleplay. It is part of the server, part of the game mode, part of the ''enjoyable'' experience in a Roleplaying server. But then again, it is only really that interesting and fun when you can win, and have a group that is possible to make these big raids.
 
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Raiding is realistic? Yes I can remember the thousand times a multi-coloured suit-wearing group of 15 thugs bhopped through my front door and executed my family for not dropping their burgers.

Perp isn't realistic, it's designed that way. :yawn:
 
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Thats the reason why I put UV bulbs in my security lights IRL so bright Suited raiders in neon suits with matching thigh shorts glow for ez wallbangs.

It’s worth noting that I’m fully aware of the way raids work on perp just like a lot of things in the game mode obviously isn’t realistic on the grounds that this is garrys mod, however the principal of targeted assaults on the means of production by rivalling drugs operations and how viable of a threat it is to people’s drugs operations isn‘t far off of how gangs operate to eliminate competition IRL. Granted, here it’s significantly exaggerated for the purpose of “enjoyable“ gameplay and I wouldn’t want it any other way.
 
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