AR on LouiV

[WolfyLuxion]

Your Steam/In-game Name: LlamaCurious / WolfyLuxion

His/Her Steam/In-game Name: bastijoo / -
His/Her SteamID: STEAM_0:1:85964757


Why Should This Player Be Punished: This person got caught breaking 3.4 by bobby-pinning and rushing into glassco from the backdoor when +5v1 and he still managed to get inside. He threw two Molotov which in that case breaking 2.5 and an invalid reason/no reasons to do so.

Evidence (Demo Required):

THE SITUATION STARTS AT 1:10

https://mega.nz/#!tQh3Ga7B

Tick:50000

 

[cardstarvipe]

I wouldent say its 3.4 cause he raided us but i would say it is 2.5 though cause he threw 2 molotovs wich resulted in cops coming cause of the fire then when the cops were here he decided to come and try and shoot everyone then we got raided and lost all our stuff

 

[Keel]

Yeah. This is clearly 2.5 but is not really 3.4 as he managed to kill most of you.

 

[JARRE]

He is causing unnecessary attention by throwing Molotov's which not only raise high alert to the people inside but also blocks of his own path to continue further in the raid. There was absolutely no reason for the molotov's as it would only end up in the property burning down which, considering he is picking the drugs, he is avoiding. He did this earlier in our regals apartment and Creepis spoke to him about it.

EDIT: I banged the guy because he sprayed 2 of us down and ran out of ammo.

 

[TheFrozenMonkeyKing]

First of all, I'd recommend filling in the in-game names

Now, I am not entirely sure if this can be called 3.4 or not. Of course, at 3:33 when he throws the molotov this close to himself, it could easily have spread and killed him, although it didn't. Wouldn't really call it 3.4 apart from that.

2.5 on the other hand is quite possible. He threw two molotovs which could have burned down multiple props, perhaps even ending up doing so in the end, as the fire wasn't extinguished. Molotoving when raiding should only be done if you are there to take revenge for something, and it seems reasonable to destroy multiple props, not simply raiding, as it easily could burn down the reason you came there in the first place.

In short, I am not too sure if I could call this against rule 3.4, but when it comes to 2.5, that is quite possible, as it quite easily could have ended with many lost props (perhaps it even did?).

*Edit: @JarredInator came with the point of it causing uneeded attention and bringing the cops. Was the guy caught in the end? As stated above I do feel like setting the building you are raiding on fire is a very bad idea. IRL you would probably have suffocated from all the smoke when he sat up there at 3:33.



(Oh, also like the nod at 3:14 to respond to the question )

 

[Creepis]

I've dealt with LouiV yesterday for breaking 2.5 (Same thing, raided our apartment with a molotov yesterday with no clear plan to get any profit out of it when literally everything burns down) but I still wouldn't believe it's 3.4 as he obviously managed to kill probably all of you by hiding in a spot in which nobody looked in which he took the chance. I'd have to look a bit into the logs to get this shiznit done.

That's it from me I guess, I'll have a look at this later on.

 

[Jimmy]

I watched the whole video and I don't get where the 2.5 is. He seemed to use them quite effectively, the first molotov thrown blocked you all from getting to him initially, confused you and hid him from you. He was able to sneak round your base, steal your shit and take you out one by one while you were distracted with the fires. Why is it that every time a molotov is used people just scream 2.5. Excessive negativity is supposed to cover causing large amounts of damage for little to no advantages, i.e burning down a shop full of guns because the shopkeeper called you a fanny. He chucked two molotovs in a large open base and that gave him a huge advantage, caused you guys to die and him to steal multiple drug plants. I don't think he did anything wrong here, there were no excessively "negative" consequences, just the usual deaths of the occupants and loss of guns/drugs so how did he break 2.5?

 

[TheFrozenMonkeyKing]

I watched the whole video and I don't get where the 2.5 is. He seemed to use them quite effectively, the first molotov thrown blocked you all from getting to him initially, confused you and hid him from you. He was able to sneak round your base, steal your shit and take you out one by one while you were distracted with the fires. Why is it that every time a molotov is used people just scream 2.5. Excessive negativity is supposed to cover causing large amounts of damage for little to no advantages, i.e burning down a shop full of guns because the shopkeeper called you a fanny. He chucked two molotovs in a large open base and that gave him a huge advantage, caused you guys to die and him to steal multiple drug plants. I don't think he did anything wrong here, there were no excessively "negative" consequences, just the usual deaths of the occupants and loss of guns/drugs so how did he break 2.5?

You have an incredibly valid point. You see, my problem here is that 2.5 is such a "loose" rule. For example killing a person that was AFK can be seen as 2.5, which wouldn't really affect them that much. What I believe is 2.5 here, is that the whole base could have burned down, barricades and all. (Drugs aswell) Luckily the fire didn't spread to damage any other barricades and all, and he was actually rather skillfull with his entire raid.
Tl;dr It could have burned down the entire base if the defenders weren't fast with their fire extinguishers.

 

[Mxdium]

I'll give you my opinion on this.

Spoiler: 2.5

2.5 Excessive Negativity- Generally speaking, players are not allowed to excessively negatively affect the experiences of other players while playing on the server. For example, destroying a number of valuable items in a store should only be done under certain circumstances, and more so as a last resort; specifically, reasons such as product prices, a ‘basic’ distaste towards someone within the store, grossly disproportionate methods to quell competition, etc, are not typically acceptable.

I don't know if it was his 'protection' fire or just to burn down the base, it looks like he used it to protect himself but still. It could've burned down the whole base and that's why I think 2.5 was broken. He also shot a lot of unarmed people without guns on their back, this can be counted towards 2.5 aswell as they were no threat to him and shouldn't have shot them.

Spoiler: 3.4

3.4 Putting your Life at Risk - Players must at all times act realistically, meaning that any actions taken that may put a player’s In-Character life, freedom from imprisonment and/or general wellbeing at risk must be done so in a realistic fashion, for realistically good/beneficial reasons and in such a way that can be justified as reasonable.


Risks are deemed to be unreasonable when it can’t be appropriately and effectively justified; for example, if a player was to rob the bank and fail, leading to their death, that player would be expected to demonstrate to an administrator that they had a realistic and reasonable plan and/or mind-set to succeed.


This rule is specifically relevant to the violation of any In-Character law, meaning that murders, thefts, etc, are all expected to be conducted realistically; for example, if a player kills another player, which results in the former’s death and/or imprisonment, it will mean that the player has failed and unless they can effectively and appropriately demonstrate/prove that they had a realistic and reasonable plan to succeed, an appropriate punishment will be enacted.


A common example would be for a player to murder a Police Officer in order to avoid receiving a traffic ticket; this would likely result in the enactment of an administrative punishment because this specific example is deemed to be inappropriate - this is because the risk (death/life-imprisonment) involved with the murder of a Police Officer is grossly disproportionate to the benefit of avoiding a traffic ticket, typically.


Another common example would be for a player to violate traffic laws without a good/reasonable reason.

Looking at the YouTube video I don't see 3.4 being broken, he was acting in realistic manners trying to avoid gun fights by sneaking past them. He also killed everyone (as far as I can see in the demo) in the building.
3.4 is not broken.

Spoiler: 3.25

3.25 Drug Harvesting - Players may not harvest drugs while being raided or when they suspect they are about to get raided if they don’t have a significant chance to escape the situation. (For example if you know you can escape you may do so
with the drugs, although you will have to drop what you harvested if you’re caught by the police/raiders)

3.25 is broken aswell, he harvested the drugs as soon as he entered the building while his life was in danger. He did this to all plants, I do not know if he died in the end but if he did this rule is broken for sure.


Conclusion;
The player broke 2.5 by molotoving the base and 3.25 by harvesting the drugs while his life was in danger.
I'll go ahead and support this thread.

 

[Skudist]

User broke 2.5 by throwing a molotov cocktail on a property for an invalid reason unless @LouiV - Louis Vuittoni can provide a valid reason. I also agree with Synatec. He did indeed break 3.25 by harvesting drugs during a raid (making his life in danger). I was also on the scene as an officer. We received multiple life alerts and a call about someone throwing a molotov into Glass Co.. I give this AR a +support.

 

[LouiV - Louis Vuittoni]

-support This is a false AR, i was raiding you guys. NOT randomly throwing a molotov cocktail. I already talked to the admin about it the day i did it..
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613145,1462612945][/DOUBLEPOST]Dude even if your armed or not, i had a gun holstered myself. I threw the molotov so everything could burn out and i wanted to shoot each one of you when you ran out of the house. YOU WERE ARMED WITH M4S!
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613380][/DOUBLEPOST]And what the hell. that video aint even me on it. Im talking about the molotov in regals!
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613414][/DOUBLEPOST]Jjjackier! I dont even fucking wear yellow clothes! I have a black suit on
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613501][/DOUBLEPOST]I swear to god this is a false post on me, 1 no name shown, 2 i dont wear yellow clothes, 3 i would never throw a random molotov cocktail without raiding the property
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613588][/DOUBLEPOST]I cant provide you a demo, when i never ever record my game plays. You are false reporting me.
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613683][/DOUBLEPOST]Well. I never raided this base. The only time i ever threw a molotov is when i raided regals apt. And admin warned me right after.
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613718][/DOUBLEPOST]Then i want the logs skudist

 

[TheFrozenMonkeyKing]

-support This is a false AR, i was raiding you guys. NOT randomly throwing a molotov cocktail. I already talked to the admin about it the day i did it..
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613145,1462612945][/DOUBLEPOST]Dude even if your armed or not, i had a gun holstered myself. I threw the molotov so everything could burn out and i wanted to shoot each one of you when you ran out of the house. YOU WERE ARMED WITH M4S!
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613380][/DOUBLEPOST]And what the hell. that video aint even me on it. Im talking about the molotov in regals!
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613414][/DOUBLEPOST]Jjjackier! I dont even fucking wear yellow clothes! I have a black suit on
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613501][/DOUBLEPOST]I swear to god this is a false post on me, 1 no name shown, 2 i dont wear yellow clothes, 3 i would never throw a random molotov cocktail without raiding the property
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613588][/DOUBLEPOST]I cant provide you a demo, when i never ever record my game plays. You are false reporting me.
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613683][/DOUBLEPOST]Well. I never raided this base. The only time i ever threw a molotov is when i raided regals apt. And admin warned me right after.
[DOUBLEPOST=1462613718][/DOUBLEPOST]Then i want the logs skudist

So if for example @Creepis could provide any logs of him shooting people at that time, we could end this rather quickly.

 

[LouiV - Louis Vuittoni]

Please admins check the logs to prove these guys are making a false AR! I know they personally hate me, i hate them too. So the only prove i got is the logs!
[DOUBLEPOST=1462615829,1462613854][/DOUBLEPOST]'

• 1. Kitty You can't really use the "it was unarmed people in there, breaking 2.5 killing them" when its no place to be unarmed when you are having glass co/parker and growing doing illegal stuff. If you use that as an excuse, you broke 3.4 for being unarmed then. "Logic"
     
     I AGREE

[DOUBLEPOST=1462618101][/DOUBLEPOST]I hope that admin sees clearly that theyre ganging up on me like that.. Check the logs admin, and let us finish this case..

 

[Creepis]

So if for example @Creepis could provide any logs of him shooting people at that time, we could end this rather quickly.

Clearing it up, will edit the OP as it wasn't LouiV. People might've believed it was you because you said THIS one sentence

- @LouiV - Louis Vuittoni Mistakes happen, just don't go bloody ham as the logs are being checked before the action request is dealt with anyways to see if it was really you or somebody else.
(Images might be huge because I got them from the phone, logs in Chrome literally freeze the browser)

Spoiler: Logs

In other words the user above (bastijoo) will receive a ban for breaking 3.25, 2.5 (Burning down props during a raid when he wasn't even being shot at from the beginning to defend himself, what's the point of raiding with a molotov anyways when everything burns down and you get nothing out of it as everything has burned down?).Due to him having such a high record (7 warnings and 8 bans (+1 ban after this)) he will receive a ban in the length of 3 months.