Punishment Type: Ban
Punishment Subtype: Server Ban
Appeal Type: Dispute[Evidence]
Which staff member issued the punishment?: @jams
How long were you banned/blacklisted for?: 3 Weeks
Your Steam Name: Google Chrome
Your Roleplay Name: Bob Bobov
Your SteamID: STEAM_0:1:191086074
Why were you punished?: 3.2 - User made in-game decisions over discord as an officer.
Why should this appeal be considered?: Context of the situation is this:
Me, Porkchop, and 2-3 others were in a call together while me and Porkchop were playing PERP. We were talking about personal stuff and other things while I was screensharing PERPheads to the others of me and Porkchop playing. They barely have any clue about the server, and I always screenshare to them because they find it fun to watch while doing other things. I talk with them and comment upon funny stuff happening because they have no clue most of the time what is happening. If you understand Swedish, you could clearly hear me speak in the third person as I am telling others not on the server what is happening. Why else would I be doing such a thing if I was on there just for the sake of metagaming?
The whole point of me when being on duty is to make sure laws are followed, and I am really strict when charging people, and I guarantee that most people who have interacted with me in-game already know this. That was my whole purpose when I went on duty—I was bored and wanted to deal with some people who did not follow the law. These guys were illegally transporting, so I told the people on Discord, "Look at this, these guys are gonna get pissed off when I take their gun," etc. I later alt-tabbed, and around that time Porkchop unmuted himself to ask if it was fine for us to confiscate their guns, to which I replied, "Yes, it's up to you, as I don't know these people and I wouldn't care if their feelings got hurt over the guns that they illegally transported." Porkchop quickly remuted right after, and we continued with the situation where he started investigating by himself, forcing the gun out of his trunk, etc.
I had told the people in the call that they were probably going to rob the bank; it was really, really obvious as the bank had not been robbed for a long time. I didn't act upon that situation at all after confiscating the guns. I went to the hospital and back to storage for the sole reason that I believed that they would break the law again, as most people do—that's just common sense. Also, I saw them walking up to storage as I was driving behind them, so it was really, really obvious that their intentions were to take new guns out. So I sneaked behind the hospital and back to the parking lot to make sure that they stored their guns. One of them stored it, and the other didn't. What a surprise. During this whole clip, you could clearly see me talking from a third-person point of view like there was no one else around me, almost like a streamer, because there were people on Discord watching the gameplay. Also, yes, Porkchop is not blind—he could clearly see the weapons and me jumping out of the car, so clearly he also jumped out to go up and talk with them.
The clip sent had me talking, and I had listened to it and didn't mute it myself when sending the clip further to people like Ashur. If I really believed that was game-breaking or something that I shouldn't have done, I would not have sent it. I just don't see the difference between what I've done compared to someone messaging a staff member asking if they would break a rule if they did this at this exact moment and a staff member tells them to do it or not. It's just called being careful and following the rules/policies.
For example, let's say me and another moderator or member of the server are together in an org and we have a valid reason to KOS someone, but I haven't played for some time and I'm unsure of the rules and don't want to break them. Then I ask them out of character about it so that I can make sure not to break the rules of the server. They respond to me that yes, it is a valid reason, and I kill them and flee. That would not be against the rules. What I don't understand in that case is how my ban in any way is different from this?
My whole point with this dispute is that me and Porkchop were on Discord, but no information was used in a tactical way to gain an advantage, as we both have push-to-talk and push-to-mute bound on our Discords. He unmuted to ask me a brief question about PD-related stuff. It did not change what the outcome would have been in any way; I was just helping him out and teaching him how to behave, making sure he was being careful not to break any kind of policy. I replied to him while alt-tabbed checking something OOC-related, and while I was alt-tabbed, he began dealing with it.
Jams had a private conversation with me regarding the ban in which he told me that me going back to storage was completely based on the fact that I assumed that they were going to rob the bank. If he had more experience on duty and on the server, he would know that almost all other cops would have done the same. I was not born yesterday; if you take someone's guns off their back, they're going to get re-armed with new ones.
As I previously said, speculation about them robbing the bank was clearly made. If I went to the bank and camped, I would 100% be agreeing with him that my actions were taken from an out-of-character point of view and disruptive. In this case, they were illegally transporting and clearly had intentions of taking new guns out afterwards, just as anyone else would have done in that situation. My goal here was to make sure their guns were stored this time and not illegally transported, as every other officer would have done in my shoes.
I was giving content to the people watching and explaining it to them as banter, or more from an entertainment point of view. Porkchop was muted, and I was driving anyway, so I don't see how it would have changed the outcome in any way. I still did the same thing, which is making sure people follow the laws. There was no communication via Discord in a way that gained extra information for my actions from me being "aids." It was just pure common sense and standard police protocol.
I don't see his vision on how this would have turned out differently in any way. They were still illegally transporting, I don't know them, and they're not new players, which would just lead to me taking their guns no matter what. I am the leading officer in that scenario, and even if Porkchop had not asked me if he should take the guns, I would have done it anyway.
Additional Information: Im disputing this for porkchop as well
Punishment Subtype: Server Ban
Appeal Type: Dispute[Evidence]
Which staff member issued the punishment?: @jams
How long were you banned/blacklisted for?: 3 Weeks
Your Steam Name: Google Chrome
Your Roleplay Name: Bob Bobov
Your SteamID: STEAM_0:1:191086074
Why were you punished?: 3.2 - User made in-game decisions over discord as an officer.
Why should this appeal be considered?: Context of the situation is this:
Me, Porkchop, and 2-3 others were in a call together while me and Porkchop were playing PERP. We were talking about personal stuff and other things while I was screensharing PERPheads to the others of me and Porkchop playing. They barely have any clue about the server, and I always screenshare to them because they find it fun to watch while doing other things. I talk with them and comment upon funny stuff happening because they have no clue most of the time what is happening. If you understand Swedish, you could clearly hear me speak in the third person as I am telling others not on the server what is happening. Why else would I be doing such a thing if I was on there just for the sake of metagaming?
The whole point of me when being on duty is to make sure laws are followed, and I am really strict when charging people, and I guarantee that most people who have interacted with me in-game already know this. That was my whole purpose when I went on duty—I was bored and wanted to deal with some people who did not follow the law. These guys were illegally transporting, so I told the people on Discord, "Look at this, these guys are gonna get pissed off when I take their gun," etc. I later alt-tabbed, and around that time Porkchop unmuted himself to ask if it was fine for us to confiscate their guns, to which I replied, "Yes, it's up to you, as I don't know these people and I wouldn't care if their feelings got hurt over the guns that they illegally transported." Porkchop quickly remuted right after, and we continued with the situation where he started investigating by himself, forcing the gun out of his trunk, etc.
I had told the people in the call that they were probably going to rob the bank; it was really, really obvious as the bank had not been robbed for a long time. I didn't act upon that situation at all after confiscating the guns. I went to the hospital and back to storage for the sole reason that I believed that they would break the law again, as most people do—that's just common sense. Also, I saw them walking up to storage as I was driving behind them, so it was really, really obvious that their intentions were to take new guns out. So I sneaked behind the hospital and back to the parking lot to make sure that they stored their guns. One of them stored it, and the other didn't. What a surprise. During this whole clip, you could clearly see me talking from a third-person point of view like there was no one else around me, almost like a streamer, because there were people on Discord watching the gameplay. Also, yes, Porkchop is not blind—he could clearly see the weapons and me jumping out of the car, so clearly he also jumped out to go up and talk with them.
The clip sent had me talking, and I had listened to it and didn't mute it myself when sending the clip further to people like Ashur. If I really believed that was game-breaking or something that I shouldn't have done, I would not have sent it. I just don't see the difference between what I've done compared to someone messaging a staff member asking if they would break a rule if they did this at this exact moment and a staff member tells them to do it or not. It's just called being careful and following the rules/policies.
For example, let's say me and another moderator or member of the server are together in an org and we have a valid reason to KOS someone, but I haven't played for some time and I'm unsure of the rules and don't want to break them. Then I ask them out of character about it so that I can make sure not to break the rules of the server. They respond to me that yes, it is a valid reason, and I kill them and flee. That would not be against the rules. What I don't understand in that case is how my ban in any way is different from this?
My whole point with this dispute is that me and Porkchop were on Discord, but no information was used in a tactical way to gain an advantage, as we both have push-to-talk and push-to-mute bound on our Discords. He unmuted to ask me a brief question about PD-related stuff. It did not change what the outcome would have been in any way; I was just helping him out and teaching him how to behave, making sure he was being careful not to break any kind of policy. I replied to him while alt-tabbed checking something OOC-related, and while I was alt-tabbed, he began dealing with it.
Jams had a private conversation with me regarding the ban in which he told me that me going back to storage was completely based on the fact that I assumed that they were going to rob the bank. If he had more experience on duty and on the server, he would know that almost all other cops would have done the same. I was not born yesterday; if you take someone's guns off their back, they're going to get re-armed with new ones.
As I previously said, speculation about them robbing the bank was clearly made. If I went to the bank and camped, I would 100% be agreeing with him that my actions were taken from an out-of-character point of view and disruptive. In this case, they were illegally transporting and clearly had intentions of taking new guns out afterwards, just as anyone else would have done in that situation. My goal here was to make sure their guns were stored this time and not illegally transported, as every other officer would have done in my shoes.
I was giving content to the people watching and explaining it to them as banter, or more from an entertainment point of view. Porkchop was muted, and I was driving anyway, so I don't see how it would have changed the outcome in any way. I still did the same thing, which is making sure people follow the laws. There was no communication via Discord in a way that gained extra information for my actions from me being "aids." It was just pure common sense and standard police protocol.
I don't see his vision on how this would have turned out differently in any way. They were still illegally transporting, I don't know them, and they're not new players, which would just lead to me taking their guns no matter what. I am the leading officer in that scenario, and even if Porkchop had not asked me if he should take the guns, I would have done it anyway.
Additional Information: Im disputing this for porkchop as well
