Action Request (Tinky, Jamie and Max)

[Jimmy Bovine]

Your Steam Name: nice meme
Your Roleplay Name: Jimmy Bovine
Your SteamID: STEAM_0:1:65261477

Player's Steam Name: Tinky, Jamie and Max
Player's Roleplay Name: Quintavius Brown, Jack Bushross and Mud Pearse
Player's SteamID: STEAM_0:0:107027937, STEAM_0:1:58009824 and STEAM_0:1:199376586

Why should this player be punished?: All three of these players raided the same property in the space of 14 minutes, thereby breaking 5.3.

Civilians are not allowed to raid, or assist others who are raiding, an occupied property more than 2 times in a 60 minute period, or *raid the same property more than once in a 60 minute period*.

*If a civilian has died whilst raiding a property, they must wait 1 hour after they have respawned before attempting to raid, or assist others in raiding that property.*

Upon reviewing the demo file I was surprised to see these three gentlemen who have an abundance of experience on the server, who are clearly familiar with the rules break it in such a flagrant way. They waited a mere 4 minutes beyond their death and NLR timers to return fully geared up for another attack, in the process breaking two clauses of 5.3. Although we easily won the first raid, we lost the second raid after having tangled communication with the police which got us all killed and our drugs confiscated. In regards to their punishment, considering their full knowledge of the rule breach and the consequences of their raid, little leeway ought to be considered.

Thank you for taking the time to read this and hope appropriate action can be taken on the matter.

Jimmy Bovine

Evidence Link: https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/oKGqi82KZiqev/d1337A6TodEC?invite=cr-MSx4RWwsNjczNzc1OTks

 

[travis]

@Tinky @Jack Bruhross @Max May you please explain your side of the story/reasoning behind this? I expect a response within 48 hours.

 

[Jack Bruhross]

hello me travis! Could you possibly give me the name of the demo file that would cover this! So I could go through it and rejog my memory!

 

[Jack Bruhross]

I came to projex and was told to "KOS p1 PEOPLE INSIDE" I was unaware of the reasoning behind and only shot the people I was told to. I didn't attempt to raid nor did I force myself into the apt. I think there might of been a reason behind the kos call but you will have to find out from max or tinky i geuss?

 

[Max]

We had done a bank robbery and were at Business Gas Station dropping off the stolen money. Cops were coming into the area from city bridge and we decided it would be best to fall back to Projex and hold defensive positions there until we got the pay-out from the money launderer.

When we pulled down to Projex there was no cars parked outside and I assumed it was empty. I went to begin checking doors to see if any of them were unlocked or if I had keys to any apartment as we could use the inside of an apartment to our advantage when defending. When I tried Projex 1's door to my surprise it was unlocked and even had a defence inside and thought we could easily use it to our advantage if the cops engaged in a firefight with us.

I walked inside and once again to my surprise there was actually a large group of people aiming guns at me inside. I ran outside the apartment and we engaged in a short firefight and once some of us had died me and @Tinky thought it would be best to retreat upstairs and continue waiting for the bank robbery pay-out instead of risking losing all the money. After we had received the pay-out we decided we should conduct a raid on the base as it housed a sizeable group of people and would most likely be an enjoyable and profitable raid.

In short, the first shootout we had that you claimed to be a raid was, in fact, not actually a raid but rather one of your members negligence to lock your door. I can understand why you would think this was a raid from your perspective if you didn't know your door was unlocked however there was no forced entry or even intention of raiding we simply were looking to escape the police.

 

[Jimmy Bovine]

Thank you gentlemen for the replies, especially to you Max for your in-depth and yet concise side of the story.

Jamie I am perplexed by the fact you claim you did not "attempt to raid" when you admit you got the KOS call, in addition to which, you continually peeked into our apartment looking to kill people. If you were not raiding, why would you shoot us?

In regards to your statement Max, I can absolutely confirm what you are saying in your first two paragraphs are true. Our door was unlocked due to Fredy raiding 6 minutes prior and we neglected to lock it after the door was repaired. Furthermore, when you enter you did so out of curiosity, that was evidenced by the fact you did not have your gun out and immediately ran out once you saw the place was occupied.

I have a problem with your last two paragraphs though, you state that the first raid was "not actually a raid" and you were "simply ... looking to escape the police", yet after your initial fright upon seeing us, you made the conscious decision to return with your firearm drawn; managing to shoot half your magazine even before we fired our opening salvo. What exactly was your intention? If you truly wanted to "escape the police", why would you launch an attack on an occupied civilian property?

https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/oNoftNfvfGpEh/d1337pIibqn8?invite=cr-MSw2eEIsNjczNzc1OTks

In your third paragraph, you are clearly aware of the fact that this raid has risk to it as you could lose the bank money but only opting to retreat AFTER losing half of your available manpower and an M82. If you had managed to successfully kill us, I'm certain that you would have taken our guns and our drugs. You are only claiming that this was not a raid because you lost it.

 

[Jack Bruhross]

Jamie I am perplexed by the fact you claim you did not "attempt to raid" when you admit you got the KOS call, in addition to which, you continually peeked into our apartment looking to kill people. If you were not raiding, why would you shoot us?

So to start of with this I wasn't even in projex until the shots was already being fired. Here is my POV

As you can see in this POV I don't turn up until people are shooting each other. At the entrance of projex I am welcomed by tinky who tells me to KILL P1 (kos p1 people inside). I am an aggressive player and abuse peakers advantage as you can see in the clip. I am constantly quick peaking and prefiring all the angles you would be shooting us from. I also died on my third or forth shot. I would also like to tell you that a "kos" is not the same as a raid. You being in the apt changes nothing,

 

[Max]

I have a problem with your last two paragraphs though, you state that the first raid was "not actually a raid" and you were "simply ... looking to escape the police"

Make no mistake, when I say "escape the police" I mean escape from them in the open business area where I would consider myself to be at a disadvantage. I would have no issue fighting the PD in a close quarters combat situation such as the Projex staircase as my rifle becomes an increasingly effective weapon to use in close proximity.

after your initial fright upon seeing us, you made the conscious decision to return with your firearm drawn; managing to shoot half your magazine even before we fired our opening salvo.

I made the decision to return fire as when I entered the property I initially seen two men, one holding a rifle in his hands looking at me ( [RG] Ashe ) and another man aiming a rifle at me ( Running bear ). This act of aiming a rifle at me is clearly a threat to my life and I do not take lightly to any sort of deadly threats, so when I vacated the apartment I took aim at where the man previously was and opened fire. Since I was being 'gun pointed' by your associate with a weapon this is a completely reasonable reaction for a person of my stature ( deadly armed criminal ).

What exactly was your intention?

My initial intentions was to reposition to have better standing to take on the police in the close quarters environment of the Projex staircase or perhaps one of the apartments, however after my life was threatened I attempted to eliminate such threat

In your third paragraph, you are clearly aware of the fact that this raid has risk to it as you could lose the bank money but only opting to retreat AFTER losing half of your available manpower and an M82. If you had managed to successfully kill us, I'm certain that you would have taken our guns and our drugs. You are only claiming that this was not a raid because you lost it

Let me reiterate that this is not a raid. A raid is forcing entry to a property, usually with the intention of theft. However there was no forced entry or intention to steal anything. Additionally retreating from a firefight because you are losing is not against the rules and is simply the logical thing to do.

 

[travis]

The first encounter, despite being fueled by an unlocked door and armed occupants, does count as a raid as @Max decided to shoot into the apartment with @Jack Bruhross and @Tinky assisting. This is because if you had won the fight, you would have entered the property to take the weapons. Even though you Max and Tinky eventually pulled away from the encounter it was still an attempt to raid. Therefore, the second raid was within the one-hour period and was not allowed within the rules. @Jack Bruhross and @Tinky will be receiving a ban for 1 week and @Max will be receiving a ban for 3 days.

Reviewed with @SamSN