Principle of Proportionality

[GP]

Is this a new law or a change to a current law: Modify law 3.2

What law do you wish to change/add: (changes are underlined)

3.2 Right to Charge
Law enforcement officers may declare someone guilty of an offense(s) by charging them with a crime which has been proven beyond reasonable doubt and through solid evidence (i.e. DNA proof, government witnesses, admissions of guilt. Civilian witness statements alone do not amount to solid evidence). There is no requirement that a charged person has to be imprisoned. When charging someone, the suspect can request a Supervisor (if available) to have their input on the matter.

Jail times and ticket amounts must take into account the principle of proportionality and reasonably proven aggravating and mitigating factors in the case. Factors include, but are not limited to the following. Aggravating factors: previous charges, premeditation, targeting of vulnerable victims, deliberate and gratuitous violence or damage to property (over and above what is needed to carry out the offense), additional degradation of the victim, multiple victims, offense committed against those working in the public sector. Mitigating factors: a greater degree of provocation than normally expected, the fact that the offender played only a minor role in the offense, admissions to Police in interview, cooperation with authorities.

Why should this change/addition be made:
Codify this standard practice currently required only by PLPD policy.

What is the aim of this change/addition:
To prevent abuses and unjustly harsh sentences.

Additional Information:

Aggravating and mitigating factors – Sentencing

www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk

 

[Maia]

I completely agree, as of now your sentence depends solely on the arresting officer, which makes little sense in my opinion, the most stupid case I can think about it is when a police officer arrests you for punching someone once and gives you a 5y 5k sentence.

I think this is a much needed addition

 

[Swaffle]

I agree with this, but how will you enforce this? I know for sure many people will complain about sentences who are justified but they think it is to harsh. Maybe some thing like a minimum/maximum sentence added to the law will make it more clear?

 

[Fielding]

I agree with this, but how will you enforce this? I know for sure many people will complain about sentences who are justified but they think it is to harsh. Maybe some thing like a minimum/maximum sentence added to the law will make it more clear?

Supervisors will need to pay attention on duty, and people can make IA's for an harsh sentence

I still want lawyers

 

[TylerReadman1]

Yeah guys ruin all the fun why don't we

 

[Maia]

I agree with this, but how will you enforce this? I know for sure many people will complain about sentences who are justified but they think it is to harsh. Maybe some thing like a minimum/maximum sentence added to the law will make it more clear?

The same way that we enforce use of force, its complicated to set hard limits and we'll go on a case by case basis

 

[GP]

I agree with this, but how will you enforce this? I know for sure many people will complain about sentences who are justified but they think it is to harsh. Maybe some thing like a minimum/maximum sentence added to the law will make it more clear?

Aggravating factors need to be reasonably proven to be applied. It's still up to the officer's and supervisor's discretion to determine if the sentence is proportional.

This law reform will mostly cover egregious cases, where an officer puts you in for the max sentence for a charge, when you did a minor thing, like punching a car once. In the future, PLPD policy could be expanded to include guidance on how to apply this.

For now, it's mostly a common sense thing (although maybe many players are lacking in this area). Don't sentence to max for a minor thing. Or don't discount the sentence heavily when they did something very serious. Case-by-case.

 

[Eric Jonson]

This will just allow players to minge around because they know they will get light sentences. I prefer the fuck around and find out way a lot of officers have. We shouldn't enable people to minge punch and do dumb shit because they know they will get a slap on the wrist due to the legal system enabling it -1 we should avoid trying to act like the California legal system not be like it

 

[Murtsley]

I disagree, this is exactly what the maximum sentences does - imposing some kind of aggravating criteria upon arresting officers seems a little excessive - if you have committed the offence, it is at the officer's discretion to reduce the sentence below the statutory maximum. This is where the most valuable legal skill you can have comes into play; don't be a dickhead. If you're not calling the arresting officer a pig, screaming your head off how this is unlawful, or requesting a supervisor every time, you are (shock and awe) more likely to get on the officer's good side resulting in a lesser sentence.

I personally adopt this philosophy, and completely agree with @Eric Jonson on this one, cool idea, but unfortunately, a lot of the criminals are unnecessarily hostile about an inconvenience that they caused - don't fuck around and find out.

 

[Maia]

don't be a dickhead. If you're not calling the arresting officer a pig, screaming your head off how this is unlawful, or requesting a supervisor every time, you are (shock and awe) more likely to get on the officer's good side resulting in a lesser sentence.

This would be one of the aggravating factors tho, that would allow you to give highest sentences.

I agree with your analysis but I do not think this suggestion goes against it whatsoever, you can still charge people with max if they're being dicks but you cannot charge people bc you dislike them and they commited a small crime.

The main goal is that in order to give max sentence there must be a reasoning, either he was being a dickhead, not complying or 1000 other things

 

[Bnjemann]

This will just allow players to minge around because they know they will get light sentences. I prefer the fuck around and find out way a lot of officers have. We shouldn't enable people to minge punch and do dumb shit because they know they will get a slap on the wrist due to the legal system enabling it -1 we should avoid trying to act like the California legal system not be like it

Someone’s lack of sense of taking laws and repercussions of their actions seriously would serve as an aggravating factor. Minge punching = unprovoked assault in the eyes of the law which would be an aggravating factor in itself.

I like this idea but many players have the IQ of a goldfish when it comes to legal interpretation to a degree that they deem it necessary and legal under “self defense” laws to magdump a running away person in response to single punch and feel like this would go over the head of said players who make up a sizeable fraction of the playerbase, and since the law wouldn’t really be anymore enforceable outside of IA keeping it as a policy is more ideal.

 

[Murtsley]

The main goal is that in order to give max sentence there must be a reasoning, either he was being a dickhead, not complying or 1000 other things

I'm waiting for this to not be a factor that should be considered by PLPD Policymakers, and my Internal Affairs inbox to be full.

I agree with your analysis but I do not think this suggestion goes against it whatsoever, you can still charge people with max if they're being dicks but you cannot charge people bc you dislike them and they commited a small crime.

Statutory maximums still provide for this, this is another thing that junior officers are going to get wrong and become disillusioned by the police job and if this is added to the UI, to clutter it even further. Furthermore, this will take away a skill that more experienced officers have which is the ability to arrest and detain people for making implicatory remarks that they will spring the person out of jail so that we do not have any difficulty with the arrest.

Aggravating factors are stupid for this server, if we were to say mitigating only, then I would agree, but I believe that the statutory maximum is the starting point - it should be treated as a privilege rather than a right for any reductions in the penalty provided.

A link to Sentencing Council is easy to do when you have a judicial body overlooking the case with regard to all elements of the offence, we as Law Enforcement Officers are required to pass sentence without access to all material facts, only ones that we see.

 

[Nottoc]

Aggravating factors are stupid for this server, if we were to say mitigating only, then I would agree, but I believe that the statutory maximum is the starting point - it should be treated as a privilege rather than a right for any reductions in the penalty provided.

Exactly this, it shouldn't be an expectation to have your sentencing reduced and would cause a lot more, 'if' factors for situations that are completely unnecessary to have.

 

[Mini]

This policy already kinda covers this suggestion, officers who give max sentences for a single punch could have a complaint sustained due to the fact that 5 years 5K for 1 single punch could cause a breach of the peace as it would cause the suspect to react with hostility leading to abuse, attempted escape, evasion etc etc so you technically don't need this in the laws because it's already in the handbook here

 

[Fielding]

This will just allow players to minge around because they know they will get light sentences. I prefer the fuck around and find out way a lot of officers have. We shouldn't enable people to minge punch and do dumb shit because they know they will get a slap on the wrist due to the legal system enabling it -1 we should avoid trying to act like the California legal system not be like it

I stg its more annoying to get a 1 year sentence then 5 years low key

 

[MaverickRat]

This will just allow players to minge around because they know they will get light sentences. I prefer the fuck around and find out way a lot of officers have. We shouldn't enable people to minge punch and do dumb shit because they know they will get a slap on the wrist due to the legal system enabling it -1 we should avoid trying to act like the California legal system not be like it

This is RP but not reality, IRL if someone punched you in the arm once would you want them in jail for 5 years and a $5000 fine ?

 

[Eric Jonson]

This is RP but not reality, IRL if someone punched you in the arm once would you want them in jail for 5 years and a $5000 fine ?

Fuck around and find out. Don't hit me

 

[Murtsley]

This is RP but not reality, IRL if someone punched you in the arm once would you want them in jail for 5 years and a $5000 fine ?

Yes.

 

[MaverickRat]

Fuck around and find out. Don't hit me

shiver my timbers

 

[phoondos]

I stg its more annoying to get a 1 year sentence then 5 years low key

Takes more time to walk to the jailer than the sentence itself