Action Request (Sonzy, Sorle, chinglao, ✨rat✨)

[Hodgparjor]

Your Steam Name: Hodgparjor
Your Roleplay Name: Orson Coffey
Your SteamID: STEAM_0:1:59290002

Player's Steam Name: Sonzy, Sorle, chinglao, rat
Player's Roleplay Name: Abdullah Albajar, Emiliano Elridge, Chikashi Fukazawa, Humphrey Smithson
Player's SteamID: STEAM_0:1:95568228, STEAM_0:0:51990442, STEAM_0:1:83164687, STEAM_0:0:51339826

Why should this player be punished?: At the begging Abdullah Albajar killed someone in my sight, however I assumed that might be self defence and simply ordered him to put his hands up. After gunpointing him I told him that I'm aware it might be self defence, and ordered to put his hands up anyway, yet the player decided to ran towards closed doors, open them, get inside and lock the doors. Moments later Chikashi Fukazawa opens the doors and asks to be bandaged. Once again, while gunpointing him I order to put his hands up, and inform that I'll bandage him in the moment. Yet the Player, similar to previous one, decides to don't care about gunpoint, does not surrender, and just walks arround asking for bandage. Afterwards 3 players inside i.e Abdullah Albajar, Emiliano Elridge and Humphrey Smithson while gunpointed by me from close proximity, after I was shouting "hands up" for previous 25 seconds, still instead of surrendering just run around inside shop, and Abdullah closes the doors just at my face. During 30 seconds of me ordering each of aforementioned players to put their hand up under gunpoint, none of them did it, which I belive was a violation of 3.4 by each of them.

Evidence Link: https://medal.tv/games/garrys-mod/clips/RvtsqMc6jYJSf/d1337SkOpEHa?invite=cr-MSxyU2ksMTQxMTk1Njg3LA

 

[Sorle]

Can't speak for the others but I can speak for myself:

waving a gun about towards the inside of a shop from outside doesn't constitute direct gunpoint forcing us to follow your orders in accordance with 3.4, there was never any direct gunpoint contact made at any point and when there's literally four of us and we're all in different places there is no physical way to keep us all gunpointed at once

in a situation like that you gunpoint one at a time or it's just not gonna work at all, most of us were never directly at gunpoint and as such this just doesn't have merit at all

 

[Hodgparjor]

I forgot to mention that in 00:33 Keira Fullerton approaches doors at which 2 officers are pointing the guns, and casually picks up the gun. I didn't notice this during situation as I was mostly focused on people inside.

 

[Hodgparjor]

Can't speak for the others but I can speak for myself:

you simply can't gunpoint 4 people at once from outside of a shop looking in, and when there's a door directly in front of us to be closed then your gunpoint just can't be maintained - the gunpoint was easily broken with slight movement and nothing was ever directed at me

in a situation like that you gunpoint one at a time or it's just not gonna work at all, most of us were never directly at gunpoint and as such this just doesn't have merit at all

As 3 of you were standing in line, I don't think it's possible for you to determine at which one of you my gun is currently pointed. I was not gunpointing 4 people at once from outside the shop, I was gunpointing 3 of you who were standing quite close to each other as well as close to the doors, from the doors, and I had clear line of shot at each one of you, and In case I would want to actually shoot, there were plenty of time when You were "easly breaking the gunpoint with slight movement". Additionaly I don't think that closing the doors when person with gun aimed at you stands basicly in them, can be considered making the gunpoint invalid without putting risk to your life.

 

[Sorle]

As 3 of you were standing in line, I don't think it's possible for you to determine at which one of you my gun is currently pointed.

exactly, the movements were so erratic that the gunpoint was never held for long enough to be genuinely worth anything & i could tell when it was and wasnt in my direction - it was in my direction for less than half a second, just to clear that up

I was not gunpointing 4 people at once from outside the shop, I was gunpointing 3 of you who were standing quite close to each other as well as close to the doors,

in this image i've shown you all of our individual paths to breaking the very vague gunpoint which floated from one point to another for the whole duration, with the door being closed we could all take the path to the other side - we were all in very distinctive locations where gunpoint could not be held from this angle in the slightest

and I had clear line of shot at each one of you, and In case I would want to actually shoot, there were plenty of time when You were "easly breaking the gunpoint with slight movement".

this is factually incorrect as i don't think fractions of a second can ever class as "clear lines of shot", or "plenty of time", and this was all you gave yourself with your aiming of your gunpoint and your movements

Additionaly I don't think that closing the doors when person with gun aimed at you stands basicly in them, can be considered making the gunpoint invalid without putting risk to your life.

i wasn't the one that did this, but i simply acted on the opportunity it prevented to get myself to solid cover

the only reason this situation went the way it did was because your movements were erratic, indecisive, and simply disallowed you from holding us at any sort of sustainable gunpoint

 

[Hodgparjor]

exactly, the movements were so erratic that the gunpoint was never held for long enough to be genuinely worth anything & i could tell when it was and wasnt in my direction - it was in my direction for less than half a second, just to clear that up

I would agree if that was beggining of the situation, but it already took long enough, and I ordered you enough times to put your hands up, therefore you all were aware what I want from you, and given the fact that you just shot intruder, I don't see any reason for not cooperating to have self-defence case sorted. Of course everything was erratic as none of you reacted to any orders.

Whether the gunpoint was viable in this situation or not I leave to the staff who has way better rule knowledge than me, however I belive that given all the factors, irl under that gunpoint noone would decide to close the doors/run arround. (perhaps besides bleeding guy).

 

[Sorle]

I would agree if that was beggining of the situation, but it already took long enough, and I ordered you enough times to put your hands up,

i received a single order personally, cant speak for everyone else, regardless the amount of times you say it doesnt really matter if the gunpoint is unsustainable

I don't see any reason for not cooperating to have self-defence case sorted.

we had just evaded police and killed multiple people, we had good reason to believe we would be wanted for murder

 

[Weazel]

Hello, in the video you can see me bleeding out. I came to you guys for a bandage thats why i didnt do /act surrender. I felt like i would of bled out if i did /act surrender as you want all 4 of us to put our hands up before you start bandaging me. I prioritised me getting bandaged before putting my hands up for you because that would very likely caused me to die of bleeding.

 

[Maia]

Sonzy (for some reason I cant tag him) will receive a 1 week ban as he displayed no regard for the gunpoint he was under, it was pretty obvious he should've complied with the officer's orders.

@Weazel will also receive a 1 week ban for the same reason. If you were bleeding, complying with the officer's orders would be the quickest way to receive assistance and save your life so this argument just accentuates the gravity of the situation.

@Sorle will receive a warning for ignoring the gunpoint. The officer was very close to you while pointing his gun and your first reaction was to turn away as you realized what was going on and trying to escape, however turning away does not make you immune to bullets and we believe you should've complied with the orders given to you.

Edit:
The sweater who minged the gun does not have a forums account but he will be warned and talked to, I will add him on steam

in this image i've shown you all of our individual paths to breaking the very vague gunpoint which floated from one point to another for the whole duration, with the door being closed we could all take the path to the other side - we were all in very distinctive locations where gunpoint could not be held from this angle in the slightest

Reviewed with @KeiwaM