Removal of Old Warnings

[Alabin]

Discussion Post: https://perpheads.com/threads/removal-of-old-warnings.27963/

Main Idea: I suggest that warnings be removed from ones record after a 3 year time period.
A poll has also been added to see if the community agrees with warnings not permanently remaining on ones record.

Full description of the idea: See "Main idea" above.

Note that this specific suggestion is only for warnings and not bans.


Why should it be added?:

Before reading through this post please go ahead and read through the discussion thread as arguments, pros and cons are more thuroughly debated there.

https://perpheads.com/threads/removal-of-old-warnings.27963/
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We have to realize that warnings are usually given for lesser rules being broken and should with this in mind not be permanent. People who have made minor mistakes e.g. such as running a red light several years ago when new to the server should not have to permanently have their record stained and future punishments based on obsolete data.

The arguments that have been presented in opposition to this suggestion have all been centered around staff wanting/needing to maintain records in order for "...staff members to understand what you've done before...".
It has also been claimed that people who have changed their ways from being minges with over 15-20 warnings to becoming proper dedicated roleplayers would be impossible to deal with for adminst if warnings didn't stay permanently.

These sort of players who have over or near 15-20 warnings are merely a fraction of players.
It would seem reasonable that the actions made by a fraction of members should not impact the entire playerbase in an undoubtedly negative way.


A few questions to ask oneself...

Do you believe that the average player is to continously be held accountable for lesser mistakes made over 3 years ago, which resulted in a warning?

Do you believe it is good to not have a server culture that excessively focuses on punishment?


Pros:

• People with a high amount and/or very old warnings get some amount of a "fresh start".
• Perpheads in general will hopefully become less focused on a culture of very stern administrative punishments. Arguably even excessively stern (NOTE: I do not exclude the warnings and bans I personally handed out, in hindsight some definately were).
• Hopefully easing up the culture of quantity over quality inside the staff team when it comes to warnings and bans given to players.

Cons:

• Staff members may prefere to utilise bans to a higher degree, even for minor offenses, knowing that any warning given will be removed in a few years time.
• Regarding people who have accumulated A LOT of warnings and bans and eventually recieved permanent bans because of this, it will not matter if their warnings are removed since the bans would still be there.
  A limitation could be made that make people who have active permanent bans unable to have their warnings removed.

 

[Tetra]

Surely they should at least have an expiry date (say like 2-3 years) or expirey date can be set depending on serverity

 

[Robin Ljungberg]

The idea is good, but no. You have a record for a reason.

And I’m pretty sure as people have already mentioned, if u haven’t been warned/banned for like 2-3 years it will have no effect in current time I’m prettty sure.

 

[Taylor]

make the warnings have 2 tabs, one tab in warnings 1-2 years old, and the other is old warnings more than 2 years, and when u click on your profile it will instead saying, for example 15 warnings, it would say 5 Recent warnings, 10 old, Or something along these lines?

 

[Allen Kennedy]

One thing that bothers me about warnings are that they often leave out important context, for example, I recently got a warning for 2.5 after I accidentally shot a guy during a raid defense who I believed may have been bobby pinning the door due to where he was and the org reports we had. The warning simply stated I shot them when they were unarmed and gave them no change to surrender or run away. Warning and ban reasons are often written appallingly, and leave out important details, or even a link to the relevant action requests. Therefore a staff member that sees this will assume the worst and just judge based on how many warnings for the same or similar rules. Not to mention, you can get a warning for blatantly running away at gunpoint, and you can also get a warning for going through red as cop when the light was bugged. Warnings should have a sort of points system in my opinion, so it can be decided how much weight a warning can carry.

 

[Deleted member 4084]

make the warnings have 2 tabs, one tab in warnings 1-2 years old, and the other is old warnings more than 2 years, and when u click on your profile it will instead saying, for example 15 warnings, it would say 5 Recent warnings, 10 old, Or something along these lines?

Alternatively, have warnings which are older than a year become "greyed out". Greyed out warnings will be classified as "old warnings".

 

[Aero]

I think warnings should stay permanent so you can actually know everything you've did wrong in the past and so you can improve on them to not do the same thing again.

The only thing I want is warnings to be private again...

 

[Allen Kennedy]

The only thing I want is warnings to be private again...

I agree with you there, public warnings sort of defeat the purpose.

 

[Alabin]

Just gotta say that if it is decided upon to put in effect a "mass unban", where understandably certain people should remain banned such cheaters for example, then you might as well do the same with all the warnings given.

Really no reason to keep the warnings if everyones ban-records are given a blank slate.


Perp truly needs a fresh start and it is important to realize that most new players likely come from being told about the server from a friend that already plays it. That was at least the case for me and many others I learned to know.


In the end it's obviously up to you guys, I'm just putting my opinion out there!

@MrLewis @Bolli @John Daymon Gaymon*

 

[CodezBlack]

There are many people who I can think of who have been banned for a while who I don't think deserve to be re-introduced into the community. It is not good for the community and will only make is more of a spiteful place to be in. I don't really support a mass urban and I can't really see myself or anyone else changing that opinion. Although I believe warnings are in place for a reason and stick around for a reason I guess we can survive if this suggestion actually goes through and happens but a mass unban is a no from me.

 

[Exnem]

There is absolutely no need for this.

Taylor mentioned something about older warnings going in its own category and recent warnings into its own category, but this is already taken into account when punishing players, so categorizing them isn't necessary.

In the end, no. Records are there for a reason, and that's to identify repeat offenders who do not look like they're improving and could be malicious/harmful to the server as a whole if left alone.

 

[Alabin]

There is absolutely no need for this.

Taylor mentioned something about older warnings going in its own category and recent warnings into its own category, but this is already taken into account when punishing players, so categorizing them isn't necessary.

In the end, no. Records are there for a reason, and that's to identify repeat offenders who do not look like they're improving and could be malicious/harmful to the server as a whole if left alone.

What you are saying isn't necessarily true... Me and other who have been staff can attest to that. Anything can justifiably be taken into consideration no matter how old it is. All in all it's up to each individual staff member.

I'm sure we one could have a lenghty discussion on the ins- and outs of wheter they are taken into consideration or not.
Nevertheless it's a freaking video game. Even in real life in most countries your criminal record is expunged, depending on the severity of the crime, after a set amount of years.


Old thread that got archived, read it perhaps:

https://perpheads.com/threads/removal-of-old-warnings.27963/#post-170621