AR on Chris

[D3luX]

Your Steam/In-game Name: D3luX / Chris Anderson
His/Her Steam/In-game Name: Chris / Chris Andrews
His/Her SteamID: STEAM_0:1:41106947

Why Should This Player Be Punished?:
2.2: Thought it would be a great idea to add some aids to the situation so he decided to play some kind of star trek music into his mic.

2.5: I believe that Chris were exceeding and were not acting within the permitted extents compared to my actions. He knew that the crash was due to my bad driving and not because I had any intentions to kill him, as well as he knew that I had no motives to ‘murder’ him.

3.4: Risked his life (/jail sentence) due to a car accident.

6.3: Drove off without dealing with any of the NPCs who were involved/witnessed the situation.

“The same thing does not apply to NPC's though, players need to ensure that the NPC's are dealt with in a manner that is appropriate. It is no longer acceptable for players to simply deal with NPC's via shooting them, players must go up to them and physically tie them up, tell them to forget everything or something along those lines.” - @MrLewis

https://perpheads.com/threads/just-a-heads-up-read-to-stay-updated.13924/


Those are the rules that I believe were broken after I by mistake drove into Chris’ car and then drove away. Please notice that the car was already wrecked at this point, meaning that it had only a very minimal economic effect to him.

Spoiler: Video of crash

About 10-15 min later Chris showed up at the car dealer with the intention to kill me. He pulled out a AK 47 in front of nothing less than 4 NPCs and a bunch of other roleplayers, including organisation members from The Standish Family, where he then killed me. He then afterward drove off without dealing with any of the NPCs.

Evidence (Demo Required):

Demo is available upon staff request.

 

[M]

First of all, convincing your friends to rate this 'agree' does not contribute to the actual verdict.

The principle really shows how much faith you put into your own argument.

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2.2: Thought it would be a great idea to add some aids to the situation so he decided to play some kind of star trek music into his mic.

Wrong. Libel.
Was not me.

2.5: I believe that Chris were exceeding and were not acting within the permitted extents compared to my actions. He knew that the crash was due to my bad driving and not because I had any intentions to kill him, as well as he knew that I had no motives to ‘murder’ him.

Did I know that though?

I had just caused you much distress as a police sergeant, placing you into jail while you strongly objected. @Riekelt, the Lieutenant, later comes along and informs me that people got out of their cars with weapons thinking that he was me, and warned me that people were looking to kill me.

Following this, you later come out of the multi story and crash head on into my car; you injured me and completely wrecked it, and drove off without even saying sorry or anything? The correlation is therefore that you are one of the people involved in trying to kill me.

3.4: Risked his life (/jail sentence) due to a car accident.

As above, I was only defending myself against a very probable predator that had already behaved in a way that disadvantaged me both economically and in terms of health, without batting an eye.

6.3: Drove off without dealing with any of the NPCs who were involved/witnessed the situation.

You were dead, so how did you derive that conclusion? When arranging your murder with the group, people agreed responsibilities and one of them did indeed deal with the NPCs.

Summary:

As PERPHeads functions on a case-law like basis, I will compare my actions to a similar 'quick assassination' here which was not condemned - in this situation, a group of raiders who stole drugs were murdered in public by a group of similar size to mine:

3.4 Putting your Life at Risk

- Players must at all times act realistically, meaning that any actions taken that may put a player’s In-Character life, freedom from imprisonment and/or general wellbeing at risk must be done so in a realistic fashion(1), for realistically good/beneficial reasons and in such a way that can be justified as reasonable.(2)

-snip-

(1) It was realistic, quick, purposed and planned. I also was not alone.
(2) I can justify this action as reasonable as I already did in response to the earlier 3.4 quote from the AR (i.e. the knowledge that assailants were actively seeking me, and that you made yourself a prime suspect for this by smashing me at your own fault and driving off.)

EDIT: Additional evidence of me being told that people are actively trying to harm me.

 

[Walker]

Although it could possibly seen as excessive to kill you over the car crash, not entirely sure though, I don't see a problem with this. Seeing as Chris had lots of people with him that he tells us

people agreed responsibilities and one of them did indeed deal with the NPCs.

so that means NPCS were dealt with and he also had a car with a driver in it ready to escape, as seen below.

Overall I am neutral because I am unsure if it was valid to kill you over a car crash, but everything else seems fine tbh.

I am unsure on the killing over a car crash at the moment because I think it could be 2.5. Depending on past experiences etc Chris could of believed this was an attempt to harm him and he took revenge because of that, if so this AR could be invalid however unless this can be proven I believe that killing you simply because you broke his car is 2.5.

 

[Riekelt]

Hello D3lux,

I'd like to request that you PM me the full demo, I'm however not the staff member handling this action request, I just want to take a look at it so that I can reach a verdict for myself and post it here as I have some question marks behind somethings being said.
[DOUBLEPOST=1457561000,1457559810][/DOUBLEPOST]Right, so here is my opinion on this:

Some guys in a similar car to what you drive, it might even have been you (very probable) were threatening me after the city lock down, thinking I was Chris, due to the extreme amount of force that was used and needed to get the city back under our control. I, being a Police Lieutenant felt obligated to inform Chris about this fact as I felt that his life was in danger.

From what I understand you rammed Chris, with what he conceived as the intention of starting a sort of personal war since you drove off, which in turn led to Chris killing you, with a contributing factor that someone, which may have very likely been you, threatened to kill him.

Also a piece of mind here, this is a serious roleplay server, try to understand that people will react as if they are in real life, (don't) try to ram into someone in real life, see how happy they are to see you drive off, and if a car like yours was reported to threaten them and the guy you rammed happens to be carrying a gun AND happens to be a criminal (as most people in Paralake) it can go south real quick.

So I do not support this action request.

 

[M]

Some guys in a similar car to what you drive, it might even have been you (very probable) were threatening me after the city lock down, thinking I was Chris, due to the extreme amount of force that was used and needed to get the city back under our control. I, being a Police Lieutenant felt obligated to inform Chris about this fact as I felt that his life was in danger.

From what I understand you rammed Chris, with what he conceived as the intention of starting a sort of personal war since you drove off, which in turn led to Chris killing you, with a contributing factor that someone, which may have very likely been you, threatened to kill him.

Thank you, Riekelt.

To put into perspective, here's the information that Riekelt gave me as LT:

The value of the car is one thing, and frustration at your complete ignorance to your actions is also of much greater impact; especially in its relevance to the information I was given shortly before resigning from Sergeant.

 

[D3luX]

As above, I was only defending myself against a very probable predator that had already behaved in a way that disadvantaged me both economically and in terms of health, without batting an eye.

I doesn't takes a smart guy to figure out that this event was not planned or intended. It was unfortunate and unexpected, I just claimed my car before I went around the corner of the parking lot and crashed into you. Now, if you consider the circumstances, like the fact that the accident wasn't designed (or done purposefully) there is not doubt that the event was unplanned and only a result of my bad driving.

You were dead, so how did you derive that conclusion? When arranging your murder with the group, people agreed responsibilities and one of them did indeed deal with the NPCs.

I were told by members from my organisation that you respawned your car and drove off without dealing with the NPCs. I would love to have some form of evidence that the NPCs were dealt with.

As above, I was only defending myself against a very probable predator that had already behaved in a way that disadvantaged me both economically and in terms of health, without batting an eye

As I said above, it had only a very minimal economic effect on you. The car was already wrecked before the accident meaning that the damage I caused would at most cost you 500$.

I bet you were at most midly injured after such a minor crash.

Thank you, Riekelt.
The value of the car is one thing, and frustration at your complete ignorance to your actions is also of much greater impact; especially in its relevance to the information I was given shortly before resigning from Sergeant.

I don't see how this is affecting we had a crash? How i would know it was you in that car?

Also:

Spoiler: Picture not co-operating for AR, kinda Suspicious

From what I understand you rammed Chris, with what he conceived as the intention of starting a sort of personal war since you drove off, which in turn led to Chris killing you, with a contributing factor that someone, which may have very likely been you, threatened to kill him.

Also a piece of mind here, this is a serious roleplay server, try to understand that people will react as if they are in real life, (don't) try to ram into someone in real life, see how happy they are to see you drive off, and if a car like yours was reported to threaten them and the guy you rammed happens to be carrying a gun AND happens to be a criminal (as most people in Paralake) it can go south real quick.

So basically, next time some rams my car in real life, i can call my friends and we can go kill him for such a small thing? Never heard about such thing before. Its way too excessive and your risking way too much in your life doing so. This would have been dealth with verbal and an economic situation.

 

[M]

I doesn't takes a smart guy to figure out that this event was not planned or intended. It was unfortunate and unexpected, I just claimed my car before I went around the corner of the parking lot and crashed into you. Now, if you consider the circumstances, like the fact that the accident wasn't designed (or done purposefully) there is not doubt that the event was unplanned and only a result of my bad driving.

As you KNOW that it was an accident, then that's fine.

But unfortunately, my calculation and perception in-character, ALONGSIDE the fact that you strictly disagreed with my actions against you during the lockdown and could have been referred to by the lieutenant, led me to believe it may have been your intention to take such action.

As a roleplaying server, there is no right or wrong answer. You feel that there is no way I should be able to reasonably derive my explanation from that event. Just because you say it wasn't on purpose, because I had a strong and valid reason to believe that it might have been at the time, it means that I have followed the rules and taken reasonable actions.

I would love to have some form of evidence that the NPCs were dealt with.

Find it yourself, innocent until proven guilty. (I will at the request of a staff member, which you are not)

minimal economic effect on you. The car was already wrecked before the accident

It wasn't already wrecked, and there is also the constraint and frustration of having to arrange roadcrew and pay the fees incurred by them etc. at the expense of someone's negligence which they failed to even acknowledge.

I bet you were at most midly injured after such a minor crash.

It was a head on collision while both of our vehicles were moving. The principle is irrespective of the degree of injury, you, the one at fault and perfectly fine to drive off, personally waiving the fact that I was injured and could have needed medical attention. Would that be characteristic of someone who has the intention of murdering me at some point? Probably.

I don't see how this is affecting we had a crash? How i would know it was you in that car?

How does anyone know anything? People find things out. It's a silly, immaterial question: since your actions were supposedly not premeditated in hindsight, it doesn't imply that if it was intentional you would have no way of knowing it was me. (also, I had a strong belief that they were intentional, compelled by other relevant events; my IC perception at the time of action is all that matters)

I don't see how this is slander in the slightest.

[DOUBLEPOST=1457563003,1457562698][/DOUBLEPOST]

So basically, next time some rams my car in real life, i can call my friends and we can go kill him for such a small thing? Never heard about such thing before. Its way too excessive and your risking way too much in your life doing so.

You haven't even considered the other factors:

• You did not stop after ramming me, you just moved on as if you had done nothing in spite of it being caused by your careless driving.
• You totally wrecked my car and caused injury.
• I was informed by a reliable source that people had been actively looking for me in order to kill me.
• In cooperation with the factor above, you were the person that most vocally and absolutely disagreed with the actions of myself and the rest of the police force during the lockdown.

 

[Deleted member 4141]

2.2 - This was not Chris first of all and second of all it was an on going joke you could say between the whole group of us. You should've consulted Chris or someone who was on scene and asked if it was Chris before making the claim

2.5 - Chris had been given information beforehand from the LIEUTENANT that you were onto him, also you didn't even attempt to go onto the right side of the road, instead you were going to speed on the wrong side until the corner to where you would've quite possibly drifted and then attempted to get onto the right side of the road. Your actions in that crash them self are not realistic in any aspect and break 3.3 in my opinion as you sped down right behind the swat van and one of the swat could've seen the crash from one of the windows and reported it to the police which would then be breaking 3.4 (Also depends on the cops) as I imagine you're one of those people that run away from the police and then you get your org together, you kill them. You didn't even make an attempt to apologise or offer to help, in fact you barely even stopped. You said "Shit" and drove off. So really with the information provided from the police and the crash, Chris could've seen that as a threat and perhaps a failed attempt at an assassination.

3.4 - Hypocrite as you attempted to speed down on the wrong side of the road, which is also you breaking 3.4 as you could've died from the collusion. Especially if the crash happened a bit more down the road when you gained proper speed.

6.3 - Actually Ezrider had dealt with the NPCs and ect whilst the assassination on you happened.

You were dead, so how did you derive that conclusion? When arranging your murder with the group, people agreed responsibilities and one of them did indeed deal with the NPCs.

I remember doing shit all, literally sat in the car watching, 10/10 would help again. xd

 

[JC Denton]

In short, I'm not supporting this AR due to the fact that it is simply libious or slander

Chris didn't play the music.
After all, you drove off after having a clearly devastating car crash that would had realistically ruined your car. Fail whale.

 

[Ash]

Denied,

I believe the circumstances given by Chris are valid and the escape plan was also valid. In future, I recommend staying on the right side of the road, and next time at least say something other than driving off.