How does the police "really" work?

[WillyVodka]

Good day!

I will start off by saying that I joined PH about 1-2 months ago, and have around 2 days in playtime now. I came from another community where the cops had all the immunity they wanted.

There were rules like "There is no such things as random arrest, all arrests are in-character.".
Theoretically, I could get arrested for "having an ugly sweater", "standing on the pavement", "having a cat", upto 15 minutes at a time. This, and alot more, happened to everyone. This would obviously be considered FailRP and randomarrest, as there was no such things in-game anyhow, and not a "valid" reason. But hey, all arrests were in-character, so you would always have to call the mayor/seargant to be released, staff couldn't and WOULDN'T do anything.

Then, after years on those two servers, I found this server. And I must say that I really LOVE the whitelisting-feature that you have for the police-department. This minimizes the opportunity to have 2-hour-players joining the policeforce and the fact that people can run around arresting randomly and minge.

I also really like the fact that there are static laws and not laws defined by each mayor.
The laws are complete aswell, and I would appreciate the need for proof.

But there is one thing that I have noticed.

There has been a couple of situations where the aggressor (not me those times) has obviously done something, the cops have seen it, but they don't have any proof, so they let them go.

I can take an example from the other day:
There was a male who punched a man besides me outside PD. I asked him "What the fuck are you doing?" and he turned around and started shoving and punching me.

A paramedic saw this, and called the police. The police told us to "walk away" and stay away from eachother. I walked, and he followed me, and on the bridge over the highway near PD, he started punching again.

I ran back to PD, and yes, he continued. The police were called, they showed up, and then he was punching me INFRONT of two officers.

I thought that hey, now they saw it too, I guess he'll get his punishment!
But no. They told him yet again to leave me alone and walk his own way.

Then he returned after 5 minutes, and started punching the 1st man that he punched (who were obviously AFK) and then me, after I called the police yet again, and they showed up, AGAIN seeing that he was punching me.

He was then let go yet again, and I was told that if I didn't stop harassing HIM by "verbal abuse" (I was pissed, told them to check the cameras and use their eyes when they SEE him punching people) I would get arrested.

This was the THIRD time that a governmental official had seen him attack me and another man, and the second time the police saw it, outside PD which also had cameras.

This is not the first time that the police has seen people do stuff like this, but really deny it, "because they don't have proof" or "There is nothing to do about it".

I am not saying that every cop is like this, but I have witnessed that the most events I have been with, whether it was a fight, robbery or whatnot, the police has usually done nothing because of proof, witnesses that doesn't count even thought they are government officials.

Even if someone chases me around in a car, threatning to kill me and so forth, the police can't do anything.

Is there something in the lawbook that I have not seen? If so, can someone explain anything about this?

I really enjoy the server and community other than this thing, so bear that in mind, I won't say that this is a reason to leave, but it is rather annoying to not feel that you are being "heard" by the police.

Greets,
Kim.

 

[Imperial Watch]

Theoretically, I could get arrested for "having an ugly sweater", "standing on the pavement", "having a cat", upto 15 minutes at a time. This, and alot more, happened to everyone.

This isn't north korea rp where cops can act without repercussion. If the cops fuck up, they are liable for a police complaint and eventual reprimand in case they have done something wrong.
The burden of proof lies with the accuser so if the cops feel like they have nothing on the accused, there is nothing you can do. However the case you have presented us with sounds like gross incompetence and you should probably post a complaint on the officers involved.

 

[joey]

If a medic saw a man punching you, his word is considered good enough evidence and also if he was punching people infront of the police he shouldn't have been let go. Aside, if these police knowingly lt him go whilst he was attacking you, you should make an internal affairs complaint on them or a report as they were not performing their duties to a good enough standard.

 

[ΙεΙίος1]

Government witnesses are considered valid proof for someone to be charged. As law 3.2 states "Law enforcement officers may declare someone guilty of an offence(s) by charging them with a crime which has been proven beyond reasonable doubt and through solid evidence (i.e. DNA proof, government witnesses, admissions of guilt. Civilian witness statements alone do not amount to solid evidence).". TL;DR a medic's witness is enough. If you believe that the officers did not act correctly and should have punished the person, make a police complaint. Info on how to make a complaint can be found here.

 

[WillyVodka]

Whoa, this is great, I am really glad that you guys mentioned the internal-affairs-complaint-thing, because that is actually something that I am willing to use!

And I will take a note that governmental officials are valid witnesses!

Thank you so much for QUICK and informative answers!

 

[joR]

Really appreciate the kind words and I'm glad you've picked up on some of the things you mentioned! It's really nice to hear something like this from someone who isn't in the department and is quite new.

So, there are the two main laws that allow for the arrest and charge of individuals:

3.1 Right to Arrest
Law enforcement officers may arrest any person who has committed or by probable cause has been suspected of committing a crime. This allows for information to be gathered by an investigation. If enough evidence has not been provided to charge the individual; the individual must be de-arrested and released as soon as it is practical to do so.

Arresting allows us to detain an individual and gather evidence so we can charge them with a crime.

3.2 Right to Charge
Law enforcement officers may declare someone guilty of an offence(s) by charging them with a crime which has been proven beyond reasonable doubt and through solid evidence (i.e. DNA proof, government witnesses, admissions of guilt. Civilian witness statements alone do not amount to solid evidence). There is no requirement that a charged person has to be imprisoned. When charging someone, the suspect can request a Supervisor (if available) to have their input on the matter.

To charge someone with a crime, like give them a ticket or jail them etc etc, we must meet the requirement in 3.2 which can be very hard in the scenarios that you have listed when it is word against word. It's so frustrating in these scenarios where you haven't witnessed what has happened and there is no evidence even though it's completely obvious that a crime has been committed.

Similar to the fist fight scenario you had, this happens so often and it's really really really hard to find who is the main perpetrator as we usually find who started it which is near enough impossible most of the time. I personally find out if they can justify punching back in the self defence and necessity law and if they can't I usually arrest and charge both parties for Physical Assault.

As mentioned, it can be incredibly frustrating when you do not have enough evidence to charge someone with a crime, however I think it's very important we maintain that level needed to convict people of a crime to make sure people are being dealt with fairly, similar to what you mentioned at the start of your post. I will be passing this message to our People Services department so they can share this with the relevant people.