Server Suggestion Reduce max cop slots

[Dom_]

Suggestion Title: Reduce max cop slots
Suggestion Description: Reduce the maximum cop slots (and scale) to 18 rather than 25

Why should this be added?:
- When the server is full and there are 20+ cops on, it doesnt matter how many people you are raiding with, crime is just impossible.

- Especially with the amount of TFU reaching nearly 100 now, there is consistently 3-6 TFU on duty at all times which is more than enough for a somewhat balanced shootout where it is still fun for both sides without the horde of pistol cops to accompany them.

- I'd also argue that 6-7 TFU on duty at once is too much, given the recent flashbang buff which makes them even more of a threat than their 200HP, AWP, ACOGs and TFU Van.

- More balanced shootouts, not just cod zombies simulator and cops will have to use a bit more of their brain during shootouts rather than just sprinting at the enemy in a horde and hoping their shots connect (which always works).

- Possible FPS improvement from less lights around the map and a shitfest worth of cop cars outside a raid all with lights on?

What negatives could this have?:
- People might not be able to get on duty as often as they'd like however this would encourage more RP elsewhere or force players to make money in an alternative/risky way or form new organizations on the server for some more civilian RP.

Useful Images:

 

[Bnjemann]

I'd be fine with slots staying the same if TFOs policies were changed e.g. only gearing up when necessary, it sucks to have M16 and UMP cops actively patrolling around the city waiting for somebody to run over in a shootout

Yeah so about that, full disclosure, I’m not ever going to change policy to turn the gear that is nerfed heavily solely to allow people to patrol with it into something you cannot patrol in. That’s the whole point of light TFU gear. Anyone who would ever implement this would be making the absolute worst decision in the PD’s history. It’s literally a cop running an Eco-raid setup. Removing it entirely would be a more viable solution but don’t go getting any ideas.

On the topic at hand, 20 officers is enough. What we really need is more medic slots.

 

[rxsm]

Yeah so about that, full disclosure, I’m not ever going to change policy to turn the gear that is nerfed heavily solely to allow people to patrol with it into something you cannot patrol in. That’s the whole point of light TFU gear. Anyone who would ever implement this would be making the absolute worst decision in the PD’s history. It’s literally a cop running an Eco-raid setup. Removing it entirely would be a more viable solution but don’t go getting any ideas.

On the topic at hand, 20 officers is enough. What we really need is more medic slots.

If 16:9 can kill the PD with pistols then the PD can pistol 16:9 with pistols

 

[FatGeorge]

If 16:9 can kill the PD with pistols then the PD can pistol 16:9 with pistols

so based

 

[MaverickRat]

omggggggggggggggggg guys, pd got wiped a few times , crim have ak, its soo over

 

[Brinch]

Totally agree with what you're saying, the only way to clearly identify if there is an issue is for someone to collate the data concentrating on peak times (@TinySlayer ), though given his previous responses to the monthly "Cops OP nerf TFU" thread, I have a feeling the answer won't have changed since then.

Hopefully, they would come less frequently and be more fruitful to the developers if the opinions were not solely based on empirical data and the polarizing ‘us vs. them’ mentality. So instead it could be discussed what a fair k/d for an officer or a TFU officer would be.

 

[HarryTheHazard]

Hello Everyone,
This is just my opinion on the subject and id very much like to hear others opinions.
As many of you are likely aware I'm a heavy cop main and recently heavy TFU main but i am also a part time crim so i do share both aspects of this debate heavily, I shall start with the cop issue, On a full pop server i have seen raiding parties of 4 take down the PD but this does not happen often at all and 8 out of 10 times its just a very unfair swarm of 1st wave pistol cops then a breach of heavy TFU which i have to say is very overwhelming as there is only so much these crims can do especially when there's drones of pistol cops throwing themselves through the doors towards these shooters they simply do not have enough bullets in their mags to counter it. I see it happen more often than not that the average reaction time when the server is full and even when its around 80 players you will still get a drone of police respond even if there is 2 shootouts at once within a minute which is usually still when raiders may be combatting defenders or vice versa which results in being sandwiched by both defenders and pistol cops and TFU. While i see the Crim aspect of why this is unfair there should not be a dramatic decrease in cop slots to 18 cops as on a full server the PD would then be outnumbered 7 to 1 in terms of player count, i feel a decrease perhaps to 20 or 22 would suffice.
Now speaking from my part time career as crim its incredible hard at times to even when you have killed the defenders you cannot get the firearms and or drugs out in time cuz there will either be a TFU sniper camping and or pistol cops in some absurd corner waiting for their moment, also what i see happen alot is the shootouts are still ongoing even after the 10 minute NLR timer for police so you get more officers relentlessly reappear and it usually just ends up in a PD win from as ive mentioned overwhelming firepower against the defenders.

So TL;DR aspect yes i do feel for the crims as being a TFU user myself i can see how incredibly frustrating it can be to be raiding and then within a minute you have 18 pistol cops and 6 heavy TFU on scene to deal with. 20-22 Max slots would be a good idea for 128 player count.

 

[rxsm]

Whilst all of you guys have been mentioning pistol cops, light tfos, heavy tfos, we’re also forgetting the many many remi cops that rush up stairs like the flash and hipfire 1tap you

 

[Allen Kennedy]

Whilst all of you guys have been mentioning pistol cops, light tfos, heavy tfos, we’re also forgetting the many many remi cops that rush up stairs like the flash and hipfire 1tap you

give them m16 rifles instead

 

[MalekIsWeird]

1) "Statistics are not honestly representative" - The moment you say this your argument loses credibility.

im telling you your "statistical evidence," is irrelevant because it does not support your argument logically. It's like me bringing my own "statistical evidence," being like:

"OMG V6 is dropping TOMORROW ACCORDING TO STATICAL EVIDENTH!"

please understand, respectfully, nobody gives a shit about it especially when its not valid or relevant and furthermore clearly illogical.

2) Anecdotal evidence is the key here. Nothing stated has been supported by any evidence and nobody has refuted any of the points I have made except through more anecdotes.

3) Whenever I play criminal I enjoy the challenge and do my best to evade the police instead of trying to solo the entire police force with an AK. The point of the game is to commit your crimes and escape the area before being captured by the police, not play CSGO and try to rack up as many kills as you can by staying in the area of a shootout.

Anecdotal evidence and testimonies from countless people is valid because a game is experienced by them, it is their view based on how their unique playstyle is being negatively affected by current circumstances. Not only did you admit that to be true by owning up to the fact your playstyle is different, you ignorantly disregard everybody else's playstyle because you hold some sort of superiority complex over them due to you enjoying the game differently. Furthermore your "statistical evidence," being invalid means the ONLY form of valid evidence presented up to this point HAS been the anecdotal evidence you so ignorantly disregard.

 

[Japzzi/JoeReel]

On the topic at hand, 20 officers is enough. What we really need is more medic slots.

What is the point of more medic slots when 9/10 times the medics are new players that barely know what is happening. EMS is in desperate need of a update, it is by far the worst job in the game.

 

[Jimmy]

im telling you your "statistical evidence," is irrelevant because it does not support your argument logically. It's like me bringing my own "statistical evidence," being like:

"OMG V6 is dropping TOMORROW ACCORDING TO STATICAL EVIDENTH!"

please understand, respectfully, nobody gives a shit about it especially when its not valid or relevant and furthermore clearly illogical.



Anecdotal evidence and testimonies from countless people is valid because a game is experienced by them, it is their view based on how their unique playstyle is being negatively affected by current circumstances. Not only did you admit that to be true by owning up to the fact your playstyle is different, you ignorantly disregard everybody else's playstyle because you hold some sort of superiority complex over them due to you enjoying the game differently. Furthermore your "statistical evidence," being invalid means the ONLY form of valid evidence presented up to this point HAS been the anecdotal evidence you so ignorantly disregard.

Completely nonsensical word vomit. When your argument has any substance I will grace you with an actual response. Disregarding evidence because it does not support what you believe is not an arguement, it is a fallacy.

 

[Tilin]

There's 2 sides to this story. Sometimes you have a single raid going on and 16 cops respond. And more often than not, you have 2-4 raids where cops spread throughout and die at each one.

This has been a discussion for ages and whatever way you choose to solve it, it will be wrong. For some people 16 cops are target practice and for some 4 are a challenge.

Bring forth an algorythm that will properly balance cops and crims and we will salute you.

Talking like a 16th century professor isn't a solid arguing point.

 

[Tilin]

so based

Not really. Huge difference when you have organisations of select members that are actually good and the government organisation, which would start a civil war with itself if it could, since it can't communicate for shit.

 

[ALOO89]

3) Whenever I play criminal I enjoy the challenge and do my best to evade the police instead of trying to solo the entire police force with an AK. The point of the game is to commit your crimes and escape the area before being captured by the police, not play CSGO and try to rack up as many kills as you can by staying in the area of a shootout.

my guy say something Fr cant last time sow you off dute doing crim i hope i see 1 day off dute

you are saying raid and escaip but in deffrent way

Convince me how would you kill 4 deffnders and store all there iteams and drugs and escaip beffor cops come ?

if you are raiding slums they will be waiting for you out sidehow would you run away ????????


you are saying something from movie or from your dreems that mean you didnt really raid someone while there is +80 players on server

There's 2 sides to this story. Sometimes you have a single raid going on and 16 cops respond. And more often than not, you have 2-4 raids where cops spread throughout and die at each one.

its very rare to have more than 2 shootout in same time or 2 raids




my idea is makeing cops same as civ cant return to the situation tell it done


- less shootout
-no long shootout
-everyone happy

 

[Jimmy]

my guy say something Fr cant last time sow you off dute doing crim i hope i see 1 day off dute

you are saying raid and escaip but in deffrent way

Convince me how would you kill 4 deffnders and store all there iteams and drugs and escaip beffor cops come ?

if you are raiding slums they will be waiting for you out sidehow would you run away ????????


you are saying something from movie or from your dreems that mean you didnt really raid someone while there is +80 players on server

its very rare to have more than 2 shootout in same time or 2 raids




my idea is makeing cops same as civ cant return to the situation tell it done


- less shootout
-no long shootout
-everyone happy

If the problem is that there is no quick or easy way to grab loot in a raid then that sounds like a completely different problem, which in turn could use a different solution.

Perhaps some kind of duffle bag which could allow a raider to store guns or drugs they steal without having to make 80 trips back to their van to store their goodies, making raiding less tedious. Like I say this is a solution to a different problem.

Unfortunately having 2-3 shootouts at once at 128 players is very common which is what makes this so difficult to balance. Factoring in RTCs, life alerts, robberys, property disputes, car thefts and everything else cops have to respond to it means that they can be spread very thinly during peak times.

 

[ALOO89]

If the problem is that there is no quick or easy way to grab loot in a raid then that sounds like a completely different problem, which in turn could use a different solution.

will i thought you can explain to me what do you mean by that "do my best to evade the police instead of trying to solo the entire police" "commit your crimes and escape the area before being captured by the police" it sound easy for you but sadly i dont think you did even try to do it

its really rare that 1-3 cops respond to raid most of the time 8-12 with at lest 1 tfu


also lets be real if raid happend in 3 places not all the pd will die in same time and lot cops hold out side the apartment waiting for someone to push out side that mean even if there is 3 raids the cops who died on slums can go to projex after they spawn and who die and projex can go to slums etc ......

Personally i think the best max count for PLPD is 15-17 mean 12 cop and 4 tfu
or

my idea is makeing cops same as civ cant return to the situation tell it done

 

[Japzzi/JoeReel]

If the problem is that there is no quick or easy way to grab loot in a raid then that sounds like a completely different problem, which in turn could use a different solution.

Aloo is right though, there is no way one can beat the defenders, grab the loot and leave before cops so up. Especially in places like Projex, Slums and Regals.

Factoring in RTCs, life alerts, robberys, property disputes, car thefts and everything else cops have to respond to it means that they can be spread very thinly during peak times.

But they barely respond to any of it? Hell sometimes police leave cuffed suspects to run off to a shootout. Shootouts get priority, how many times can't the glass at Jennifers get broken but no response from PD? This just boosts Aloo's problem/argument that since shootouts get priority it is very hard to finish a raid and get out before police start arriving.

 

[MalekIsWeird]

Completely nonsensical word vomit. When your argument has any substance I will grace you with an actual response. Disregarding evidence because it does not support what you believe is not an arguement, it is a fallacy.

you grace us all by not speaking my refutation is valid and the fact not only crim but also cop mains agree with 25 upvotes speaks for itself.

Stay in your bubble of ignorance.

 

[Clarky]

Whilst all of you guys have been mentioning pistol cops, light tfos, heavy tfos, we’re also forgetting the many many remi cops that rush up stairs like the flash and hipfire 1tap you

Remi cops rn

 

[Eric Jonson]

though you was supposed to be professional (silly) pd main

Ain't on duty bro I'm under no obligations at this moment lol