Police Suggestion TFU Taking Charge Policy

[Jack P]

Brief description of idea: In conducted raids, such as Drug Raids, massive shootouts etc which TFU is more skilled/Trained to handle, then pistol cops or cop who just aren't TFU that they take charge. This means if a Senior Officer is TFU, and is the highest ranked TFU on duty, can tell Senior Officers and below to go away from the place they are standing, or change location they are gonna have to listen. As of rn, there are situations where I as a Senior Officer as TFU, has been yelled at by other Senior Officers for not being higher rank than them, in shootouts and that I CAN'T tell them to go somewhere else, which in real life. SWAT Officers take lead in stuff like shootouts, raids, hostage situations, bank robbery's etc.

Of course if there's a Corporal+ on as TFU, they would take charge, basically the highest ranking officer in TFU would take charge, with certain limits of course. But in general highest ranking TFU Officer would.

What benefits would this idea have for the department: Give more purpose in TFU, and making it more realistic. TFU would be able to do their job properly, and not some stubborn same rank officer will get in the way of them.

What potential negatives could this have for the department: Same rank officers, who's not TFU might get butthurt and complain.

Other additions:

 

[MiniXIII]

This is literally part of a TFU Trainers role description.

 

[Jack P]

Yeah, but there's no direct policy to it. So if someone doesn't listen to TFU in raids you can't make an IA on them for it if you're not higher rank than them.

 

[MiniXIII]

Handbook does state TFU are responsible for dealing with complex situations though. Plus most supervisors order their subordinates to step back or go on perimeter while TFU handle the situation. And if they don’t follow that order then they’re breaking law 4.2 and breaking the insubordination policy.

Edit: Personally I don’t feel this is needed as a non-TFO Sergeant may have more experience and is more competent than a Corporal ranked TFO.

 

[Jack P]

@MiniRaze Yes, responsible but doesn't directly mean TFU can order that, it's been confirmed by several people, even Command teams such as @A1L That there is no direct Policy Against it, plus I've gone through several policy's and handbooks none of them stating that you can DIRECTLY take command over the same rank if their not tfu, so if they refuse to move away from a location, There's not much I can do. Fx have an IA on someone running with a situation that happend, chances that person will get any kind of formal punishment is very low.

 

[MiniXIII]

@Jack P I never said they can order people, I was just stating they are responsible and that most supervisors tend to adhere to that hence the most typical response to a raid or shootout etc is ‘Below CPL Perimeter’ ‘CPL+ or TFU can go in’

 

[MiniXIII]

I don’t see the need to give TFU unnecessary power and boost egos.

 

[CensoredExe]

Any LT+ in any division is going to be much more skilled than a CPL even if theyre TFU.

I think TFU trainers should outrank in certain situations up to LT, but - they already do in reality.

 

[Jack P]

Yeah, that's what I meant with certain limits aswell

 

[Bnjemann]

This is already a thing in the standard operating procedure for situations which call for it.

 

[Smeris]

This means if a Senior Officer is TFU, and is the highest ranked TFU on duty, can tell Senior Officers and below to go away from the place they are standing, or change location they are gonna have to listen

Being a cop shouldn't be a ranked circlejerk. "NO, I HOLD A HIGHER VIRTUAL RANK THAN YOU, SO DO WHAT I'M TELLING YOU". I think that it's important to understand that even a pistol cop wants to get into action as well, that shouldn't warrant an instant policy violation the moment they peak a door. I know that it's incredibly frustating when a regular officer disturbs your supreme tacticool 1337 noscope tactic and i've busted myself on this behaviour sometimes as well but shouting at someone in a shooting game to get out of the shootout doesn't help.

You're TFU. You deal with specific situations because you have been trained with additional weapons and equipment. While you're examined on how you take iniative and provide leadership, this leadership shouldn't extend beyond the front door of the property you raid in my opinion. Take iniative as much as you can, the amount of virtual chevrons on your shirt means fuck all, but you should not have the golden right to overrule corporals, sergeants or other officers just because you are trained for heavy weapon scenarios. Yes, officer definitely should give you the room. It's described by policy and SOP that TFU is to handle , but suggestion this doesnt fix the issues you described.

Give 'pistolcops' some of the action aswell. Get them involved in situations. You depend on them to do your duties as a TFU officer correctly. have them stack up the staircase behind you, point them at strategic locations where they could give you information and shoot some suspects aswell. Officers would probably cooperate with you much easier if you tell them: "Hey, if you stand there i can more easily breach myself and you can hold point, so i can bust down the other door and we will move in together" instead of "fuck off kid im tfu i bust down doors, go do perimiter". Not saying that this is your behaviour or something, just an example as i've seen behaviour like this often, beyond TFU. Senior officers, even ones trained for TFU do not posses the amount of experience needed to take over situations. It is after all, a rank that requires only 2 OR's and 3 days of total playtime.

 

[Jack P]

Let's put it simple, I didn't tell him to hold perimeter, or leave. I told him to go away from the door, cause he kept screaming to put warrant on a property and gunpointing whilst we attempted a tactic. And he refused, the same officer went right infront of me, in a shootout aswell almost getting us both killed.

 

[Smeris]

It's dangerous behaviour and if possible, get a corporal to cuff them and drag them out. It's more than just insubordination and definitely warrants punishment. It's unfortunate if you do not have the ability to cuff officers, and even more so if there are no cpl+ on duty to so, but this suggestion wont fix this issue. People who violate SOP and policy tend to do so. A few words making it more clear that they should listen to TFU, doesn't automatically mean they will.

 

[rat]

the plpd isnt meant to be organised idiot

 

[Jack P]

Fight me 1v1

 

[rat]

sorry i dont take orders from senior officers

 

[Jack P]

Pussy

 

[Tetra]

My two cents on this situtation.

The current policy states only TFTO/supervisors/command can overrule during a situtation. This is fine as the current policy. Just because you get TFU does not mean you hold any more authority than other officers. There is a reason supervisors exist thus allow the higher ranks to handle situations.

Something you need to understand is how useful pistol cops can be during a raid, you complain about them getting in the way and doing stupid stuff however how are they ever gonna learn the correct way if they are just stuck on permineter 24/7.

Pistol cops can have many uses during a raid (suppressing fire allowing the TFU officer to reload/bandage, retrieving bodies) and keeping an eye on your backside in case of flankers.

In conclusion this suggestion just seems to allow TFU to have an EGO boost/power trip. Wait till you become a supervisor then you can order people about.

 

[Jack P]

Unless there's atleast 3 tfu on, I almost never tell pistol cops to hold perimeter. Nor did I tell another officer to hold perimeter all I told them to do was move way from the door.

Something I don't don't us that you've even read my thread cause I didnt say tfu takes charge in every situation or everything, I said in raids cause THAT'S what they do in real life.

 

[Jack P]

I dont really give a crap that you think it's egoistic, there is a reason you're tfu, there is a reason you have bigger guns. This is cause you're literally TRAINED to handle harder situations than a pistol cop. Pronto, it really isn't harder to understand.